Tomonobu Itagaki On Dead or Alive 5: “My Daughter Was Totally Ruined”

Argentus

Well-Known Member
If Itagaki makes a new fighter I really have no reason to play DOA anymore. The series lost all its aesthetics and charm after he left, and when it comes to legit fighting it's still nowhere near as fun as something like SF or Tekken. Nevermind the scummy DLC practices
I disagree on SF and Tekken being more fun, but I agree on the first part.

If he came back to DOA or made another fighter, I'd probably flock back to him, because he was far better at making a game entertaining and fun. DOA5 was borderline ruined for me since it dropped virtually everything that MADE DOA what it is. Thats why 5 vanilla felt like a poor man's tekken instead of a modern DOA. if it werent for the music and stages from past games, 5U would be just as sickening. In past DOAs I loved everything about them, but in 5, I only even got it because I liked Mila's design. Hated literally EVERYTHING else about DOA5.

I hope he does come back to DOA and take the reigns again. I've said it before and I'll say it again, but Itagaki had a sense of style and presentation that the new guys just DON'T, their approach is too flowchart formulaic. There's no imagination with them.

Not to say he didn't have his faults (DOAX2, DOA4 endings) but it was still a huge step above 5.
 

JKT

Well-Known Member
Hayashi:
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I really would love it if he gave a response
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Argentus

Well-Known Member
Itagaki leaves and we wind up with the turds that are Ninja Gaiden 3, and DOA5 Vanilla. Both dropped everything that made them fun, and attempted to instead do everything "by the book" trying to do a call of dutyish "easy success" formula, resulting in the two blandest things Team Ninja has ever made.

5's popularity has nothing to do with Hayashi, or Team ninja. Its because of the FGC working hard to promote it. The game itself is still a hollow shadow of DOA's former self. When doa4 came out, online play and promotion wasn't as ubiquitous as it is now.
 

Goarmagon

Well-Known Member
Standard Donor
Itagaki leaves and we wind up with the turds that are Ninja Gaiden 3, and DOA5 Vanilla. Both dropped everything that made them fun, and attempted to instead do everything "by the book" trying to do a call of dutyish "easy success" formula, resulting in the two blandest things Team Ninja has ever made.

5's popularity has nothing to do with Hayashi, or Team ninja. Its because of the FGC working hard to promote it. The game itself is still a hollow shadow of DOA's former self. When doa4 came out, online play and promotion wasn't as ubiquitous as it is now.

The thing is the community wouldn't have promoted it had it not played drastically different than it did in 4. Itagaki is known for not really giving a fuck about what people think of his game and had those changes not been made then I wouldn't have given DOA a second chance and many other people as well. The criticism that something was lost are valid ones but to say nothing was gained and the new director had nothing to do with DOA's new success is just absurd. Itagaki would have said(and did so in DOA4) "This game is finished, deal with it".

Also DOA2 on the Dreamcast FTW.
 

Tenryuga

Well-Known Member
I started with DOA5. The things I missed out on were past stages and better outfits. Other than that I have no regrets because gameplay wise this iteration of DOA is far superior to the other ones. This version of the game added more depth to the stun game and interactables. Literally the main reason I have heard from people that may prefer DOA 3.1 is because of the + frames on some moves and how stun > launch was better back then. As much as I love stun > launch and would like to see a slight damage boost from those juggles in this game the stun system of DOA 5 is better because there are more layers. From a gameplay standpoint this game does everything better than the past iterations and at best just needs a little bit of polishing in some areas IMO.

I'm with DOAN on this one. If this developer can make DOA aesthetically better then alright. If he is going to turn it into another DOA4 and even worse destroy any chances of this game getting taken seriously and developing into an even greater fighting game....FUCK this guy.
 

Princess Kasumi

Well-Known Member
Itagaki is truly jealous of DOA5's population.

He is being quite rude to DOA5 & Like playing the innocent guy who never tried to "hentai" aka sex the female girls by making their breasts jiggle in a match.
The girls already have jiggly boobs in DOA1. DOA2 put the age to 99 to make their boobs jiggle as hard as possible.

b8d4049e34fbb0eea222c9482ff4d44a.png

Itagaki's fans are only casual players at best. The only thing he can change in "the futureDOA" is stages & make character endings. That is it. He can not make a proper fighting game. DOA4 has horrible gameplay.

I am glad Itagaki left Team Ninja.
Main Reasons:
He is an xbox fanboy, he would only release DOA series on XBOX.
He wanted to end DOA with DOA4.
He can not make a proper gameplay.
He released DOA extreme beach volley ball to earn extra money, the game had only mini modes, big dissapointment ITAGAKI!

Tomonobu Itagaki, Needs to leave Team Ninja & DOA alone. Your "DAUGHTER" does not need you.
 

Argentus

Well-Known Member
I started with DOA5. The things I missed out on were past stages and better outfits. Other than that I have no regrets because gameplay wise this iteration of DOA is far superior to the other ones. This version of the game added more depth to the stun game and interactables. Literally the main reason I have heard from people that may prefer DOA 3.1 is because of the + frames on some moves and how stun > launch was better back then. As much as I love stun > launch and would like to see a slight damage boost from those juggles in this game the stun system of DOA 5 is better because there are more layers. From a gameplay standpoint this game does everything better than the past iterations and at best just needs a little bit of polishing in some areas IMO.

I'm with DOAN on this one. If this developer can make DOA aesthetically better then alright. If he is going to turn it into another DOA4 and even worse destroy any chances of this game getting taken seriously and developing into an even greater fighting game....FUCK this guy.
No you missed on the entire dead or alive experience.

If doa5 is just a drunken brawl in an alley, then past doas were wwe title matches with fanfare, hyped up entrances, endorsements, character roles, crowd pleasers, etc.

The action may not be as real, buy it was way the fuck more entertaining :)
 

Force_of_Nature

Well-Known Member
Standard Donor
No you missed on the entire dead or alive experience.

If doa5 is just a drunken brawl in an alley, then past doas were wwe title matches with fanfare, hyped up entrances, endorsements, character roles, crowd pleasers, etc.

The action may not be as real, buy it was way the fuck more entertaining :)
Out of curiosity are you a casual player or a competitive FG player?

Also DOAN & Tenryuga hit the nail on the head with regards to DOA4 & DOA5. DOA4 did minimal to further the franchise as an FG. It was just fortunate to have released at the right time + having support from MS.
 

Kronin

Well-Known Member
My personal opinion is not that Itagaki is an incompetent guy, just that he is never been interested to create a competitive fighting game according to the standard definition: this is something that got further confirmations from the statement of @Mr. Wah claming that Itagaki doesn't really love the genre (or also that DoA3 started as a Tag game, something that could have influenced very strongly the acclaimed competitive mechanics in single regardless of what the team was trying to achieve).

Mr.Wah or @Rikuto stated that during the last D.I.D before the launch of DoA Dimensions, the special guest Shimbori was questioned about some of the choices done with DoA4 and he answered saying how Itagaki love fast paced games. This is a simple answer but that IMO summarizes perfectly well what Itagaki tried to create with DoA4 (or in some extents even NG2). I continue to find the game very funny but even an ignorant technical player as me can get that feeling of randomness that pervades all the game, for giving room to the speed and the action in exchange of balance fighting choices. Something that is just the opposite of what happens in DoA5.

I agree that in terms of presentation and "casual" contents - I don't really like to use this term - the old Team NINJA made a better work (but we haven't to forget that in the past they weren't in collaboration with Koei, something that surely influenced parts of these aspects), but for the rest I believe that the new one made a greater work, making of DoA5 the most popular title of the series - even helped from the end of the Microsoft exclusivity.

In my opinion the fault - but also virtue - of the current TN is that they acted extremely careful so far, trying to limit the risk the most possible with DoA5 (the plain stages are an outcome of it) for not ruining the experience of competitive FGC that they were trying to achieve with it. I believe that in the recent interview posted on FSD Shimbori indirectly admitted something similar: he mentioned how they have already new ideas for mechanics to implement in the series, but that for DoA5LR they chosen purposefully to not include them for not allowing a possible ruining of a game as DoA5U, a game that they believe already works pretty fine in its current shape.

But this aspect - making the game a success in the competitive scene - remains anyway a real revolution for DoA because it's something that for the first time ended to be one of the main focuses of a title of the series, thought already on the paper for being succesfull under this aspect (and according to the words of Itagaki, we should think that this was almost a side effect for DoA2 and DoA3). IMO it's this the drastical difference from the DoA of the new team against the DoA of the old one.

I repeat that in all this is a shame that the good old casual aspects of the game - part of the identity of the series - were partially forgotten, otherwise we fans would have got a perfect DoA (at least in my opinion). And appear even a shame that just with DoA5, dicatated from the new policy of the producers, there is a bigger focus on the sexy elements that cover the rest of the game in the title that has to offer the most technical elements in the series. However TN seems aware that DoA5 is missing the first ones and I'm optimistic for seeing back an attention on these matters in future (not in DoA5LR but rather in a new title as DoA6).

PS: A last thing, I respect Itagaki and his genius side but we have to remember that the old DoA wasn't the outcome of a man, exactly how the new one is not only the work of Shimbori or Hayashi. There is a team behind and Itagaki was able to do what he did even because other people worked with him. I know that many old memebers of the team followed Itagaki when he left TN, and he could be able to create a DoA like in the old times only having under him also similar people.
 
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Argentus

Well-Known Member
Out of curiosity are you a casual player or a competitive FG player?

Also DOAN & Tenryuga hit the nail on the head with regards to DOA4 & DOA5. DOA4 did minimal to further the franchise as an FG. It was just fortunate to have released at the right time + having support from MS.
I don't have the time or money to go to tournaments so I can only play online.

That said I was always hesitant to join the "competitive" community because I don't like the general impression and attitude I've gotten from it, which boils down to "a fighter can't be serious or competitive unless defense is minimized so attackers can do rushdown and long combos without interruption.", among other mentalities like "its not broken so long as its in my favor", or the similar, "don't fix a character, just break everyone else."

I played 3, 2u, 4, and 5. 5 is the only one that didn't even feel like a dead or alive game no matter how I look at it. It feels like just another fighter, whereas past doas really stood out on their own.
 

CommanderWiggles

Well-Known Member
Itagaki is truly jealous of DOA5's population.

He is being quite rude to DOA5 & Like playing the innocent guy who never tried to "hentai" aka sex the female girls by making their breasts jiggle in a match.
The girls already have jiggly boobs in DOA1. DOA2 put the age to 99 to make their boobs jiggle as hard as possible.

b8d4049e34fbb0eea222c9482ff4d44a.png

Itagaki's fans are only casual players at best. The only thing he can change in "the futureDOA" is stages & make character endings. That is it. He can not make a proper fighting game. DOA4 has horrible gameplay.

I am glad Itagaki left Team Ninja.
Main Reasons:
He is an xbox fanboy, he would only release DOA series on XBOX.
He wanted to end DOA with DOA4.
He can not make a proper gameplay.
He released DOA extreme beach volley ball to earn extra money, the game had only mini modes, big dissapointment ITAGAKI!

Tomonobu Itagaki, Needs to leave Team Ninja & DOA alone. Your "DAUGHTER" does not need you.


Again, since people are very well putting this out there: who freaking cares about who is casual and who isn't? Itagaki's fans being casual has absolutely nothing to do with his actions or words. Competitive players, stop looking down on casuals. Casuals, stop looking down on competitive players.
Like, seriously.
I'm sorry Princess Kasumi, but I hate it when people just bring up the whole "CasualvsCompetitive" concept. A true gamer has passion towards his or her game, no matter how competitve or how casual he or she is.
Like I stated a few times on Facebook, I think there is something a little more shady along the lines to why Itagaki left- such as the "bonus" suit and the sexual harassment claims. Of course, they're not supposed to detail outside of the law, so we're left ambiguous over it. I would say to just calm all yo' teets and wait until Itagaki shows his true intentions to wanting to go back, and to what [truly] sparked him to leave it, because I don't believe the bonus had anything to do with it at all.
 

Star Outlaw

Member
For some people, more realism or a better fighting system is more appealing/entertaining. Skip to bottom for tldr version.

Itagaki's response really doesn't surprise me. This is how he acts and what he does. I know how much he dissed on Tekken, and I even remember reading how he dissed on Devil May Cry 3 right to the lead designer's face way back in the day, in comparison to Ninja Gaiden. I like both games, though I am more of a DMC fan. I won't get into which of those I think is better since I think they're too different to really compare well. The only games I know of him admiring are the Virtua Fighter games, and even then I get the feeling he probably thinks he did it better.

Itagaki has a big ego, and it makes it hard for me to really take him seriously. At the very least I take anything he says with a big grain of salt. But I'll tell you what my experience with DOA has been over the years. I played 3 way back in the day when it came out. I loved fighting games so I played them all. I enjoyed 3, but I can't say it really hooked me. I felt like the characters felt too flat (haha, breast sizes, haha, coming from a VF fan). They really did just kind of seem like Barbie dolls to me, and I had a hard time investing much interest in them. My favorite character was Brad because he was the most fun to me. I liked some of the music too.

Moving on, I was really impressed when the release trailer for 4 came out. I got very hyped for it, but in the end the same sort of thing happened. I got bored with 4 really quickly, and the characters just didn't hook me. I liked Lisa, I thought she had a cool design. The stages were cool too, but it wasn't really enough. At the same time, I also felt like 4 was a little too weird for me. Not weird in a cool fun way for me either, just weird in a way that put me off. Worst, I feel like it kind of ruined Brad, and I stopped liking him as much. He went from a badass, fun loving drunken master to just kind of a drunk, pervy bum.

By the time 5 came around, I had lost interest in the series, and I never bothered with the Xtreme games. The inclusion of the VF guest characters intrigued me, but not enough. Then, Jacky was announced, and he's one of my favorite VF characters. So, I downloaded Core Fighters and gave it a try. I've found that 5 has hooked me like none of the past games really have.

Maybe it is formulaic, maybe I'm just giving into what what's mainstream, but I know what I like. Maybe I'm just here for the Virtua Fighters. Maybe it got less "anime." Don't get me wrong, I can sympathize with fans who don't like change. I'm a Devil May Cry fan. I don't think that 5 was such a huge departure from the series. I actually like the characters a lot more now than I did before, and I don't think too much had to be sacrificed for it. Tina's one of my favorite characters now. I still think that it relies too much on sex appeal, but at least the game mechanics are good. Too much DLC? Maybe, but you aren't forced to buy it, or even download the compatibility packs.

tldr I like 5 a lot and Itagaki just has sour grapes, though I do sympathize with people who liked the general style of the past games. I like DOA in general, but I don't like Itagaki.
 

R4712-VR88

Active Member
who freaking cares about who is casual and who isn't? Itagaki's fans being casual has absolutely nothing to do with his actions or words. Competitive players, stop looking down on casuals. Casuals, stop looking down on competitive players.
Like, seriously.
I'm sorry Princess Kasumi, but I hate it when people just bring up the whole "CasualvsCompetitive" concept. A true gamer has passion towards his or her game, no matter how competitve or how casual he or she is.

I'm not trying to bring up a Casual vs. Competitive arguement. I simply stated that there's casuals making dumb comments, and since this is a competitive forums I'd figure it'd be a nice warning so people could just skim through what they wanted. I have nothing against casuals except they tend to have no concept of reality just like what you read in many of those comments.
 

CommanderWiggles

Well-Known Member
I'm not trying to bring up a Casual vs. Competitive arguement. I simply stated that there's casuals making dumb comments, and since this is a competitive forums I'd figure it'd be a nice warning so people could just skim through what they wanted. I have nothing against casuals except they tend to have no concept of reality just like what you read in many of those comments.
I was in those comments (moreover support of how broad my imagination was growing up, you didn't expand my comment so I don't know if you read it or not). It's one of those, "Found the casual!" but I love the game for a different reason; I don't think it should have been generalized like it was in your comment, because there are people in that screencap who are actually pretty cool.
No one should even bring it up, because who cares if that person is a casual or competitive? Itagaki has followers. I respect him, but not his decisions. It was just rather rude to stamp the casual label in terms of stereotyping, especially when some of those in the screencap are also members of the site.

I was thrown around for liking the game a different way at one point of being part of the community (not FSD in general).

I look up to Itagaki, and respect his opinions because they're similar to mine, but I don't think he should have made certain business decisions that he made. But that's why I think it's better to wait out for him to explain his motives other than for people to just rush to shartstorm mode and tear him apart.
 
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