DOA5UA 2.00/DOA5LR 1.01 Balance Changes (Location Test)
- Thread starter werewolfgold
- Start date
Tempest
Well-Known Member
Honestly the nerf to 7k is probably not as bad as it looks, the push back means that worse case scenario certain moves will be able to strike punish it if the opponent reacts quickly, much like Lisa's 4h+k.
Momiji already has plenty of other safe pokes in the mid range neutral game (66P, 44K, 2H+K, H+K) and this change is not going to harm her in any significant way, it just means 7K isn't going to be giving out free space on block anymore against an attentive player.
Also I wouldn't consider 7k a keep out tool considering that if it doesn't land on block it's pretty easy to punish once the active frames run out.
7K is a keepout tool, that's exactly what I use it for once I've conditioned people to respect the H+K. 7K was also a good mid to combat other i12 mids and it's what allowed her to control Helena's mid strikes in CQC neutral. Because Momiji's 6P is decent, but weak due to 17 damage.
Sure you can use the i12 highs but it's the fact that she had something to make people respect the mid hit level, that was important.
Also, don't forget what I said;
"That move" was Momiji's 7K, that role will convert to H+K now, which isn't a big deal at all. However 7K was fine as is.
I know a lot of people who have mained this character since the release of 5U. I've sub-mained her for about 8+ months and I am completely comfortable with the character compared to most. Enough that I am counter hitting people with H+K, 7K and 3K on reaction as soon as they whiff something within' strike range.
7K was never a get out of jail free card, it was good move that has good application when you realize what it is.
Tempest
Well-Known Member
I'm sorry, I didn't realize what you meant about it being a keep away tool until after I posted. When you compared it to 3h+k I assumed you were talking about it as a move that can just be thrown out in the neutral game. I too believe that it's supposed to be used as a punishment tool in response to your opponent (and that function has been left completely untouched), but it was also perfectly legitimate to use it in CQC with the intention of it being blocked (creating space and putting Momiji in a very preferable range) or landing on counter (creating space and doing respectable damage).
Usually low risk moves like this are slower (like Ayane's 3H+K that you pointed out) or they have high recovery frames to compensate (like Lisa's 4h+K). 7k was a weird outlier and I don't think its unwarranted for it to be more in line with everything else.
Zeo
Well-Known Member
I think Momiji 7K being nerfed safety wise was a completely right choice. The move has a ridiculous amount of overall utility (I played Momiji, I know this), was fast, had high priority due to it's damage and was mostly safe as a poke. The risk vs reward was imbalanced.
- Overall Safe poke due to the incredible pushback
- Wall splats
- i12 so it's beating out mids to go along with her 2P game
- great keepout tool.
You could just throw it out there most of the time. Now, like other 7Ks, you have to be smarter about it. I approve 100%.
- Overall Safe poke due to the incredible pushback
- Wall splats
- i12 so it's beating out mids to go along with her 2P game
- great keepout tool.
You could just throw it out there most of the time. Now, like other 7Ks, you have to be smarter about it. I approve 100%.
7K being -25 is something I'll get used to, because I'm a player that never complains, I adapt. It's going to make me be even more careful with it than I already am. I still don't approve of that change though, I have reasons but it's just my opinion.
SweetSauceBoss
Well-Known Member
werewolfgold
Well-Known Member
I can try to do more legit translation a little later. But, not now, because I'm at work. If someone else wants to help out, I won't stop them. I'm not super decent on Japanese used specifically for fighting game terminology (surprisingly).
I'd think the official translation would be coming in a week or so, but I'm gonna guess that people don't want to wait for that...
I'd think the official translation would be coming in a week or so, but I'm gonna guess that people don't want to wait for that...
"Adjustment strategies coordinated action too much tossing and aerial combos of damage, and more specific information"
I dunno why this cracks me up, but tough luck for Helena players. You gotta stop tossing your opponents around!
For Kokoro's P+K, I don't know if it was necessary to make it throw punishable on block now since it is slow and a high. I would've probably made it a slight negative on block like -3 to -5 or something. As for Momiji's 7K, it's now like Christie's 7K in terms of disadvantage on block (assuming TN removed the pushback). Shit was so abusable lol. You could've used it like a DP if you wanted due to it effectively being safe on block. The move is still really good but can't be as freely spammed now which I think is fair. Safe i12 7K-like moves are dumb IMO.
SMH also at Christie being relatively unscathed.
I dunno why this cracks me up, but tough luck for Helena players. You gotta stop tossing your opponents around!
For Kokoro's P+K, I don't know if it was necessary to make it throw punishable on block now since it is slow and a high. I would've probably made it a slight negative on block like -3 to -5 or something. As for Momiji's 7K, it's now like Christie's 7K in terms of disadvantage on block (assuming TN removed the pushback). Shit was so abusable lol. You could've used it like a DP if you wanted due to it effectively being safe on block. The move is still really good but can't be as freely spammed now which I think is fair. Safe i12 7K-like moves are dumb IMO.
SMH also at Christie being relatively unscathed.
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Nestor Collazo
Member
i'm bummed that christie received virtually no real nerfs, but at the same time i can grit my teeth because it seems that a lot of low to lower-middle tier characters are seeing some buffs. but there are still a few characters which i am sad to hear were unfairly nerfed or just generally shown no love / acknowledgement whatsover. overall this is typical doa5 fare.
on a side note, i am laughing at all of you crying over momiji's 7k nerf. yes, i'm laughing pretty heartily. my soul feels like a warm bowl of chicken noodle soup now. just thought you should know.
on a side note, i am laughing at all of you crying over momiji's 7k nerf. yes, i'm laughing pretty heartily. my soul feels like a warm bowl of chicken noodle soup now. just thought you should know.
I mean, considering that she has other, faster highs with similar / better reach (one of which launches on CH)... There's no point in it if it's not a frame trap or the move properties have been changed pretty drastically. Hoping that it'll be something cool / unique that I can incorporate into my play style.
HAHAHAHAH I LOVE THIS UPDATE BWHAHAHAHHAHAH.
It doesn't matter buff or nerf, I will continue to increase my skill and prowess as a Tina player. My throws are a tad bit stronger now. Thanks. I'll take it. I'll take and adapt to whatever is thrown my way.
It doesn't matter buff or nerf, I will continue to increase my skill and prowess as a Tina player. My throws are a tad bit stronger now. Thanks. I'll take it. I'll take and adapt to whatever is thrown my way.
Vincent Rayne
Active Member
yet another move thrown in the "kokoro useless move" category. the list is pretty big compared to other characters which is a shame. someone needs to talk with TN and get some reasoning behind some of their changes cause i can't wrap my mind around some of them.
Hory shet….those Akira nerfs -_- Why you do this, TN?! *Does impossibru face*
I am happy that Jacky got that Slide Shuffle K critical burst change though.
I am happy that Jacky got that Slide Shuffle K critical burst change though.
I think TN is afraid of his ora, Ora, ORA! So they used the nerf bat for self-defense.
Akira deserved to be nerfed. He was (and still is) pretty ridiculous compared with the majority of the cast. 12F 2P that's +1 on block? 80 guaranteed damage from landing an 18 or so frame move on block? Some of, if not the best juggle damage in the game, both from CB and from launching in level 1 stun? He doesn't need ridiculous throw damage on top of that, or guaranteed CB from 214P.