If you haven't heard yet. The current version of DOA5U restores unholdable attacks after an opponent techs in a juggle.
I have, as of this post, not found any setups that are useful.
It's best to find a mid or low hitting attack that gives an advantage on hit/counter hit/ guard or safe options.
So far, I still would rather take the bnb juggles with the +6/+13 option select.
List of currently found unholdables
Against Wall
On Heavyweight ()
On ()
On ()
On ()
On ()
On ()
I have, as of this post, not found any setups that are useful.
It's best to find a mid or low hitting attack that gives an advantage on hit/counter hit/ guard or safe options.
So far, I still would rather take the bnb juggles with the +6/+13 option select.
This information applies to Hayabusa but the formula and the way of finding unholdable setups apply the same way for everyone else. (Remember this DOES NOT apply to roll back techrolls)
(In Dojo,Tatami)
Pick Hayabusa and go ahead and set the computer to tech roll and second action to hold. After doing that do the following set up and make sure to HOLD after the combo to see the hidden data and read the explanation below.
Normal hit Hayabusa QCF+Punch, then 8P,3PPP = +26 Frames on techroll and plus the cpu holding.
When you hold during an opponents recovery to find out the hidden frame data, You must take into consideration the initial frame of the hold. Normally the example above would have been -5 if the CPU did NOT hold which would mean you would only be +25 after doing the subtraction of your initial hold but, again, the game is also taking into account the initial frame of the hold. When both you and cpu hold then you cancel out the initial frame since both of you are doing the same move to find the same information and the game takes into account the CPU’s initial frame for the hold and yours. The end result is that the +26 is the correct amount of frame advantage.
Also +26 is the amount of frames your opponent cannot move. Theoretically speaking and assuming that your opponent decides to hold after the tech roll then the hold wouldn’t actually become active until the next following frame of you actually being able to move. +26 is your +advantage but the 27th frame means you can now move, block, attack or do something and the 28th frame would be the hold becoming active.
This theory make sense currently because the move that is currently unholdable is hayabusa's QCF+Punch after the techroll to the side, which according to the games Frame data is 25Frames but we all know it doesn't become active until the 27th frame.
I just showed you that you are allowed to move, block or do something on the 27th frame but the hold WILL NOT come out until the 28th frame. I know this to be true because if you set the CPU to attack instead of hold then the game will register the fact that he attacked on the 27th frame and will show a counter hit on the screen. This also applies to Sidestepping by the way.
The Sidestep doesn't become active until the 1st frame so if your opponent were to sidestep in this situation it would be considered NORMAL hit instead of counter hit because the set up didn't allow for the sidestep to have enough time to activate.
Apply this same formula from Hayabusa to your character and you will see that this applies to everyone in the cast and it will probably be the most consistent way to test unholdable set ups.
Hope this helps for those that didn't make it or didn't understand the stream last night. Post questions if you need help and feel free to share.
-MASTER
List of currently found unholdables
- Counter hit Juggle ends with 3KK (opponent techs fore/background)
- 3P+K
- Juggle ends with 33PP
- 44P+K
- 6PK, 4H, 2K, 6P+K
- 6P 7K 1K 3P (Lightweights)
- 6P 7K 1K 1K lightweight
- 6P 8K 6PK Whiff P 3P+K (Side Tech on Lightweight and super light)
- 6P 8K 6PK Whiff P 66P+K (Back Tech on Lightweight and super light)
- 6P 8K 6PK Whiff P 66P+K (Midweights)
- 6P 8K 6PK Whiff P 3P (Heavyweight)
- 6P 8K 6PK Whiff P 6K (Super Heavyweight)
- 6P 7K 1K 33P (Mid to Heavyweights)
- 6P 7K 1K 41236P+K (Back tech Mid to Heavyweights)
- 6P 7K 1K P+K (S. Heavyweights)
- Critical Stun > 33PP 44P+K
- Counter or Hi-Counter hit 6PK Whiff P 41236P (S. Heavy)
- CH or HCH 6PK Whiff P 66P (Heavyweight)
- CH 3KP Whiff 2H+P Whiff H+P 214P
- 3KP Whiff 2H+P Whiff 64H+P 3P
- 3KP Whiff 2H+P Whiff 64H+P 66K
- 3P+KH+P Whiff 2H+P 6P
- 3P+KH+P Whiff 2H+P 3K
- W! W! :[[p+k]]:
Against Wall
On Heavyweight ()
- CH 6KP W! 9PKP Whiff P 214P
- CH 6PP W! 9PKP Whiff P 214P
- CH 6PK W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
- 1PP W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
On ()
- 6KP W! 9PKP Whiff 4P 3P
- 6KP W! 9PKP Whiff 4P 66K
- 6KP W! 9PKP Whiff H+P SS K
- 6PP W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
- 6PK W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
- 9PKP W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
- 214P W! 9PKP Whiff 4H+P 44P
- 44P W! 9PKP Whiff 4H+P 44P
- 1PP W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
On ()
- 214P W! 9PKP Whiff P 214P
- 6PP W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
- 6KP W! 9PKP Whiff 4H+P 6H+K
- 6KP W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
- 6PK W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
- 33P W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
On ()
- 214P W! 9PKP Whiff 4H+P 66P
- 214P W! 9PKP Whiff H+P 214P
- 6PP W! 9PKP Whiff 6P 3P
- 6KP W! 9PKP Whiff H+P 214P
- 6PK W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
- 1PP W! 9PKP Whiff 4H+P 44P
On ()
- 6PP W! 9PKP Whiff H+P 214P
- 6PK W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
- 6KP W! 9PKP Whiff H+P 214P
- 1PP W! 9PKP Whiff 4P 3P
- 66K W! 4K Whiff 4P 6H+K
- 33P W! 9PKP Whiff 6P 3P
- 33P W! 9PKP Whiff 6P 66K
On ()
- 6PP W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
- 6KP W! 9PKP Whiff H+P 214P *Loop with 6H+P if 214P W!*
- 33P W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
- 6PK W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
- 9P9K W! 9PKP Whiff H+P 214P
- 214P W! 9PKP Whiff 4P 3P
- 214P W! 9PKP Whiff 4P 66K
- 1PP W! 9PKP Whiff 6H+P 214P
- 66K W! 4K Whiff 4P 6H+K
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