Jaguar360
Well-Known Member
I've been playing DOA Dimensions extensively, so I'm going to talk about some characters and their positions on the tier list.
I'm far from finished with this, as I still need to go through the rest of Tengu's matchups and talk about other characters. (I have a lot to say about Alpha's low placement)
And can someone tell me why Kasumi Alpha is so high on the tier list? From what I've gathered, she's just an inferior Kasumi. The only thing I know she has over her is that her 3H+K actually launches and her 33K is better than Kasumi's, but apart from that, her parry is worse, she is weaker, her combo potential is worse, she doesn't have any guard breaks apart from 9PK, whereas Kasumi has 4P+K to put on pressure, her throws are the same, she doesn't have limbo stuns like Kasumi's H+K...what are her advantages besides speed? She seems like she should fall to B rank or even C rank.
Summary:
As a whole, Tengu has a lot of trouble getting in since he is so slow and unsafe. However, Tengu does have some nice tools at his disposal. His throw punish game is just incredible with 4T being a solid 8 frame throw doing 60 damage, 2T a 4 frame throw that does 70 damage and takes great advantage of ceilings, electric floors and cliffs, and his flying stance throws, which are surprisingly easy to pull off since they are so quick at 5 frames. The flying throws are quite handy for punishing those who guard after tech rolls and punishing low wake-up kicks. 7KP is one of Tengu's fastest moves but it is probably the least safe move in the game, so it can only be used sparingly. 1P+K is nice for getting frame advantage and evading highs, but it takes a long time to charge at 45 frames, so its use is also somewhat limited. 2H+K and H+K are also notable moves for Tengu and are fairly quick and capable of launching into an air throw, but they are still unsafe on block. Tengu's best launchers are H+K, 3P and 8K, H+K being the quickest and most reliable, but it is a high and hits the wall. 3P is just useful because it is a mid and it can be used against a wall, but it is still on the slow side. 8K is not all that useful aside from being able to be used against a wall, as it often misses in stuns, is slow and is outclassed by H+K in general. Air throws are usually easy to get from these, but Tengu will whiff the air throw if the opponent is launched too high or if the opponent is launched too low (usually as a heavyweight). The sumo stop (4H+K) has a helpful use of providing pressure during a stun, getting from advantage on block or a ground bounce that can be comboed off of on hit.
Character Matchups:
3-7 - Tengu has a really hard time getting in on Busa because of Ryu's speed and Tengu's sluggishness and unsafety. Tengu relies on throw punishing to beat Ryu, but Ryu's throw pressure with the Izuna Otoshi can discourage blocking from Tengu, so he can easily be taken advantage of. Furthermore, Tengu often relies on high punches like P+K, PPP and 8PPP, which can be brutally punished by the Senko Izuna. Thus, Tengu relies on 7K, H+K and 2+K to get in on Hayabusa, all of which are unsafe and can be punished by Ryu's 6T, 214T or even the Izuna Drop in some cases. Tengu really has to fight for a win in this matchup.
4-6 - Tengu has an easier time against Gen Fu than he does against Hayabusa, but Gen still has the advantage overall thanks to the speed of his punches, his parries and his safety. However, Tengu can often use the parries to his advantage with Flying T and is not too afraid of Gen Fu's throws to block and punish or use 66T. Since Tengu on has one good low (2H+K), Tengu is still relatively easy to parry despite the fear of his powerful throws and Gen Fu doesn't really mind Tengu being a heavyweight since Gen Fu can still use 6PPP as a combo ender most of the time, which keeps Tengu close.
3-7 Hayate is one of Tengu's worst matchups, if not then Alpha. Hayate is just so fast in this game and really good at providing pressure with the advantage he gets on his combo enders and force techs/psuedo force techs. Tengu is pretty much helpless in stun and must make really good predictions to get out and not take a crapload of damage. Tengu relies on throwing out 7K and 2H+K when predicting a strike or throw and getting damage whenever he can. Hayate's speed, unpredictably in stun and overall solidness make this matchup a nightmare for Tengu.
3-7 Kasumi is another really bad matchup for Tengu. She has nearly all the things Tengu hates: speed, parries, pressure, a good throw game and great movement. However, she is unsafe for the most part, so the block-and-punish strategy still works. At the neutral game, Tengu is at a great disadvantage though he has ways to get around Kasumi, either by blocking, using 2H+K to evade a jab or circumvent a high parry, 7KP to beat 1PP and some mids, and 66T to beat some slower strikes from Kasumi and her parries. Kasumi will win most of the time however and keeps the pressure going throughout the game with ocassional force techs, good throws like 33T, speedy strikes, her 4P+K guard break and 9K to evade wake-up kicks or put Tengu at a disadvantage.
Placement on the tier list:
Tengu is pretty deserving of D rank on the tier list, as he is about on par with Brad and Bass and generally has poor matchups thanks to poor speed and a plethora of unsafe moves. However, he, like Bass and Brad, is still very much usable and is capable of pushing his way through the cast.
As a whole, Tengu has a lot of trouble getting in since he is so slow and unsafe. However, Tengu does have some nice tools at his disposal. His throw punish game is just incredible with 4T being a solid 8 frame throw doing 60 damage, 2T a 4 frame throw that does 70 damage and takes great advantage of ceilings, electric floors and cliffs, and his flying stance throws, which are surprisingly easy to pull off since they are so quick at 5 frames. The flying throws are quite handy for punishing those who guard after tech rolls and punishing low wake-up kicks. 7KP is one of Tengu's fastest moves but it is probably the least safe move in the game, so it can only be used sparingly. 1P+K is nice for getting frame advantage and evading highs, but it takes a long time to charge at 45 frames, so its use is also somewhat limited. 2H+K and H+K are also notable moves for Tengu and are fairly quick and capable of launching into an air throw, but they are still unsafe on block. Tengu's best launchers are H+K, 3P and 8K, H+K being the quickest and most reliable, but it is a high and hits the wall. 3P is just useful because it is a mid and it can be used against a wall, but it is still on the slow side. 8K is not all that useful aside from being able to be used against a wall, as it often misses in stuns, is slow and is outclassed by H+K in general. Air throws are usually easy to get from these, but Tengu will whiff the air throw if the opponent is launched too high or if the opponent is launched too low (usually as a heavyweight). The sumo stop (4H+K) has a helpful use of providing pressure during a stun, getting from advantage on block or a ground bounce that can be comboed off of on hit.
Character Matchups:
3-7 - Tengu has a really hard time getting in on Busa because of Ryu's speed and Tengu's sluggishness and unsafety. Tengu relies on throw punishing to beat Ryu, but Ryu's throw pressure with the Izuna Otoshi can discourage blocking from Tengu, so he can easily be taken advantage of. Furthermore, Tengu often relies on high punches like P+K, PPP and 8PPP, which can be brutally punished by the Senko Izuna. Thus, Tengu relies on 7K, H+K and 2+K to get in on Hayabusa, all of which are unsafe and can be punished by Ryu's 6T, 214T or even the Izuna Drop in some cases. Tengu really has to fight for a win in this matchup.
4-6 - Tengu has an easier time against Gen Fu than he does against Hayabusa, but Gen still has the advantage overall thanks to the speed of his punches, his parries and his safety. However, Tengu can often use the parries to his advantage with Flying T and is not too afraid of Gen Fu's throws to block and punish or use 66T. Since Tengu on has one good low (2H+K), Tengu is still relatively easy to parry despite the fear of his powerful throws and Gen Fu doesn't really mind Tengu being a heavyweight since Gen Fu can still use 6PPP as a combo ender most of the time, which keeps Tengu close.
3-7 Hayate is one of Tengu's worst matchups, if not then Alpha. Hayate is just so fast in this game and really good at providing pressure with the advantage he gets on his combo enders and force techs/psuedo force techs. Tengu is pretty much helpless in stun and must make really good predictions to get out and not take a crapload of damage. Tengu relies on throwing out 7K and 2H+K when predicting a strike or throw and getting damage whenever he can. Hayate's speed, unpredictably in stun and overall solidness make this matchup a nightmare for Tengu.
3-7 Kasumi is another really bad matchup for Tengu. She has nearly all the things Tengu hates: speed, parries, pressure, a good throw game and great movement. However, she is unsafe for the most part, so the block-and-punish strategy still works. At the neutral game, Tengu is at a great disadvantage though he has ways to get around Kasumi, either by blocking, using 2H+K to evade a jab or circumvent a high parry, 7KP to beat 1PP and some mids, and 66T to beat some slower strikes from Kasumi and her parries. Kasumi will win most of the time however and keeps the pressure going throughout the game with ocassional force techs, good throws like 33T, speedy strikes, her 4P+K guard break and 9K to evade wake-up kicks or put Tengu at a disadvantage.
Placement on the tier list:
Tengu is pretty deserving of D rank on the tier list, as he is about on par with Brad and Bass and generally has poor matchups thanks to poor speed and a plethora of unsafe moves. However, he, like Bass and Brad, is still very much usable and is capable of pushing his way through the cast.
And can someone tell me why Kasumi Alpha is so high on the tier list? From what I've gathered, she's just an inferior Kasumi. The only thing I know she has over her is that her 3H+K actually launches and her 33K is better than Kasumi's, but apart from that, her parry is worse, she is weaker, her combo potential is worse, she doesn't have any guard breaks apart from 9PK, whereas Kasumi has 4P+K to put on pressure, her throws are the same, she doesn't have limbo stuns like Kasumi's H+K...what are her advantages besides speed? She seems like she should fall to B rank or even C rank.
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