DOA5LR Ayane Combo Discussion

[OSTCarmine]

DOA doesn't seem like the type of game where secondaries are purposed necessarily for bad matchups. That's more for games with zoning and whatnot. That's just my opinion. I'll be playing Ayane only for as long as I'm playing this game.

I would still like to pick up somebody else as a secondary, thats why i asked for any bad matchups. that way, the 2nd character can at least have more purpose beyond variety. as it turns out, this isnt really such a big problem so im just gonna choose whoever i feel like. im thinking either leifang or kokoro, i like both ba ji quan and tai chi so...

 

[iHajinShinobi]

In my opinion tools in DOA are so universal that you almost always have answers for things. So matchups aren't actually that lopsided.

If you want to see lopsided matchups, go watch a BB:CT Tager vs Nu match, or a P4A Kanji vs Elizabeth match. DOA5 has nothing close to that bad.

And Arakune vs Taokaka in BB:CT @_@

 

[lripthejackerl]

As an Ayane player, I sometimes feel obligated to pick up a second character only for the simple fact that I get a lot of crap about "NInjas" on XBL. But at the same time, I really don't feel like picking up another character. The way I see it is, I'd rather knowing EVERYTHING there is to know about my main character and what she/he is capable of and learn the matchups, rather than knowing just enough of multiple characters.

Aside from that, kudos to the players out there that can pick up multiple characters and be amazing with them all. Respect.

 

[iHajinShinobi]

People on Xboxlive drink too much grape flavor hateraid, apparently.

 

[argilium]

are all the combos in the first post guaranteed?
if so, i notice that none of them are CB combos.. will CB combos be posted as well? or at least optimal stun combos with a couple of variations since they're not guaranteed?

 

[OSTCarmine]

are all the combos in the first post guaranteed?
if so, i notice that none of them are CB combos.. will CB combos be posted as well? or at least optimal stun combos with a couple of variations since they're not guaranteed?

Its actually pretty hard to get reliable CB with Ayane when you have to stay facing forward. I have not yet found a way to get it of sitdown, which would have been optimal. IMO they should have given her CB from front or back, or even just from back... but what are you gonna do?
This combo is from another Ayane thread
KK 3P CB
you can follow with BT4K BTPP6KK4 7K
the launch height from this is actually a bit awkward for me. It requires a bit of timing and that can be tricky with lag in the mix. I would prefer preciser options here.

 

[hypersonic]

NH 66KK4 starter
1)2P,5PP,H+K,66KKK =95
2)2P,5PP,6P+K(critical burst),8P,(BT)4K,6P,PPPK =113
3)2P,3P*,4K,PPPK =92
4)2P,3P*,H+K,66KKK =95
* With stagger escape on ,2P can't combo into 3P, but if they mash a strike you get a counterhit from 3P and can follow up with another 66kk4 combo or whatever.If they hold wrong they get hit by 3P but i don't know if you can do anything from that.
5)5P,3P,H+K,66KKK =94
6)5P,6P+K(critical burst),8P,(BT)4K,PP8KKK =99
7)5P,(BT)4K,PPPK =81
8)5PP,6P+K(critical burst),8P,(BT)4K,6P,PPPK =107
9)4K,5PP,8KKK =82

Tried to write as many options to force the opponent guess during the combo string.
New to DOA btw.

 

[iHajinShinobi]

Guys, the way the combo format works is that it shows which attack (Starter) launches the opponent, followed by a juggle. Not a starter attack followed by full stun setups into launch. Nothing of the sort should be written as a whole combo because you are suppose to be free to mixup attacks during the stun threshold into launch.

@argilium: Yes, all combos listed in the OP so far are all guaranteed. I haven't bothered with her Critical Burst yet because, well, to be honest, she doesn't seem to need it yet. She's still good at stun > launch. Stun > threshold is not Ayane's primary focus.

@FSD: I'll add more combos and some force tech combos later on today. I'll also edit in the damage output for the combos I put up last time.

 

[bingsoo]

Guys, the way the combo format works is that it shows which attack (Starter) launches the opponent, followed by a juggle. Not a starter attack followed by full stun setups into launch. Nothing of the sort should be written as a whole combo because you are suppose to be free to mixup attacks during the stun threshold into launch.

@argilium: Yes, all combos listed in the OP so far are all guaranteed. I haven't bothered with her Critical Burst yet because, well, to be honest, she doesn't seem to need it yet. She's still good at stun > launch. Stun > threshold is not Ayane's primary focus.

@FSD: I'll add more combos and some force tech combos later on today. I'll also edit in the damage output for the combos I put up last time.

you are awesome.

 

[lripthejackerl]

I bought the strategy guide with DOA5. It specifically says, to my surprise if I may add, that Ayane's Critical Burst shouldn't be depended on because she has so many mix-ups already.

 

[OSTCarmine]

I bought the strategy guide with DOA5. It specifically says, to my surprise if I may add, that Ayane's Critical Burst shouldn't be depended on because she has so many mix-ups already.

yep, I almost never use it cuz I can get reliable 100+ Dmg without it quite easily. A simple 64H can net you 70 guaranteed (with the right conditions). Also a well timed 66K4 opens up your opponent quite well leaving you with BT4K, BT4P or BT3P. You can mix this in from any forced tech, somebody listed a few nice ones somewhere in this thread though im not sure if they have been added to the main just yet. Basically all you do is get in a launch that leaves Ayane BT (super common lol) then force tech and keep up the pressure. They start Holding and you start Throwing. 64F+P is my best friend lol
edit - i think if Hajin is gonna list any burst combos he will probably make the CB starter, and leave it up to the player how to get there. If this IS your plan, Hajin, may i suggest adding into that section some (fairly) reliable ways to get up to the point of bursting? Not everybody is going to burst for max damage, some people may just want to pull off a fancy shmancy hoity toity powerblow

 

[argilium]

i think the practicality that i can see with CB's besides being fancy is just for the use of a powerblow into a high damaging environmental object as a high risk comeback when you're low on life.. the fact that we don't and shouldn't rely on CB much anyway means that they probably won't see it coming.. some nice crtical stun threshold building would be nice.. you can just indicate in the stun combo to which points are escapable.. for example, BLUE for high hold, this PURPLE for mid punch hold, this PURPLE for mid kick hold, (Ayane needs more purples.. haha..) RED for low hold, GREEN for stagger escape only (i don't even know which ones are), and the rest (the guaranteed ones after the hit preceding it) are just BLACK, plus if you want, Bold Italic for the launcher..

example: (plz correct me, i'm most likely wrong coz i don't exactly know these move's properties).. i'm going to use some of the stuff from EMPER0R_C0W's combo video..

66K, 2K, 4K, PPPK

6K2K, K, (BT)4K, (BT)PP6KK
6K2K, PK, (BT)4K, (BT)6P, 8KK, (BT)7K
6K2K, 3P, 6P+K(CB), PB

6P+KK, 3P, H+K, PPK6H+K

4P, 6K, 4H+K, 4P+K, 4P, PP4PP7K

3KK, (BT)H+K, (BT)P, 6P+K(CB), PB

(Soka)P, 33P2K, 6P+K(CB), PB

one could at least clearly see where the holes in the stun combo are, which ones are guaranteed, and which ones you could probably use based on the holding habits your opponent frequently does..

btw, is there any place here in the Ayane subforums that lists which moves do which type of stun on which type of hit?

 

[OSTCarmine]

its far easier to just familiarize yourself with Ayane's general mixup game and string things together on the fly, than learning these ones and choosing which situation to use them in. At least for me it is... trying to remember this stuff mid-game is a nightmare for me. Thats why I had so much trouble with Emperor Cow's initial combo list. Sure, in training I can do them just fine, but mid-match when the pressure is on it seemed to always boil down to 6K2K launch and PPPK for me lol.
Later i tried Hajin's combos and had way more success. It helped me transition from DOA4 type play to DOA5 type. Just my two cents.

 

[argilium]

heck, i'm not really learning them, i'm just using them as an example (and i'm probably mistaken on some properties and which points are guaranteed or not).. i recognize that Ayane is better off with mixups, whiff punishment, and stun to launch.. but as you have suggested in your previous post that perhaps we can add in the thread some fairly reliable ways to get up to the point of bursting, i have also suggested a format that we can use for such cases, to help us visualize the risks that we could be facing if we so choose to go for CB..

 

[lripthejackerl]

its far easier to just familiarize yourself with Ayane's general mixup game and string things together on the fly, than learning these ones and choosing which situation to use them in. At least for me it is... trying to remember this stuff mid-game is a nightmare for me. Thats why I had so much trouble with Emperor Cow's initial combo list. Sure, in training I can do them just fine, but mid-match when the pressure is on it seemed to always boil down to 6K2K launch and PPPK for me lol.
Later i tried Hajin's combos and had way more success. It helped me transition from DOA4 type play to DOA5 type. Just my two cents.

I'm the same way. I watched Cow's video, and I watch Ayane's combos in those "Balance" videos Team Ninja release. And yes, in training mode, I picked up the combos easily. But like you mentioned, mid-fight trying to remember all those "flashy" combos and certain situations is stressful. For the time being, I'm just trying to memorize all her mixups and strings and use them on the fly. Once they become second-nature, THEN I'll start going for the more flashy combos.

 

[iHajinShinobi]

Updated the OP. Added in damage output to some earlier combos, and added in some viable force techs.

 

[iHajinShinobi]

Since there are so many folks that want to see some Critical Burst combos added in the combo list. I've decided that I'm going to let anyone pitch in a few, however, it HAS to be something worthwhile for a viable Critical Burst setup. Not just any random setup into CB > Power Blow.

 

[MajesticBlue]

From what I can see Ayane doesn't really have too many stuns deep enough to beat out an SE. In regards to landing a CB I mean. Her PP stun is one of her few options that I can see.

CH 6K2K PP 6P+K. Beats all SE but is not really a great setup by any means.
CH 2K 6K_6P PP 6P+K That 2K on counterhit is gonna be hard to SE. So they would have to be on the ball to block the 6K. _means or btw. Both don't look all that great to me. Does anybody know her deepest stun? Ch 3PK can be used as a starter on those as well.

 

[iHajinShinobi]

The thing about 6K2K and 3PK is that the low followups of both are so easy to hold. Any setup for CB using either as a starter wouldn't be too proficient IMO. Both are good strings since they have follows that will counter hit if interrupted (probably can be side stepped though). You do have CH 6P though.

If I ever followed up on a confirmed 6K, I'd just do 6KK afterward. If the first 6K is being slow escaped, then you followup with the low for critical stun. I've done this to "everyone" in DOA4 previously and had it to the point where people would try holding mid kick against me, opens them up for a throw.

 

[MajesticBlue]

I agree. Was just throwing them out there. At least they can beat SE. From what I can tell she doesn't have any real use for CB. The risk vs reward just isn't right. Maybe with further testing something will be found. Just need that missing puzzle piece.

On CH F+K you can hit 66KK4 4PK. Should work on all weights I think.