Thoughts on Diego and NiCO

[werewolfgold]

This is exactly what baffles me. The current age range is 18-26 excluding Nyotengu. If Marie and the other two weren't 18 Ayane would be the only 18y/o with Kasumi and Kokoro being 19. There would be 3 girls under 20 and 8 girls at 20 or over.

It's not about the range. You're grouping all of the "young" ages together to bolster your point. It's specifically about the age "18". We don't need four 18-year-old characters (5 if you count Nyo being 1018, 8 if you count DOAXVV) just like we don't need four 21-year-olds or four 25-year olds. It becomes odd when it seems like you're dead-set on a specific age over and over again. And then on top of that, with "18" being the barely legal age and their intentionally making child-like characters, it becomes extra dumb. Akin to a nod and a wink.

 

[deathofaninja]

This is exactly what baffles me. The current age ranger is 18-26 excluding Nyotengu. If Marie and the other two weren't 18 Ayane would be the only 18y/o with Kasumi and Kokoro being 19. There would be 3 girls under 20 and 8 girls at 20 or over. Does that look skewed to anyone? The teen group got smaller and the 20+ group is got larger. As for the "realistic spread of ages" there are still 4 younger girls in an increasing cast of 19+ y/o like how it has been since DOA1. Just look at the actual numbers. The only difference is the minimum age is now 18 instead of 16 or 17 (and we know why DOA can't go lower). Nothing really changed.


Sure you can say that but that is meaningless though. Compared to the old DOAs the format is exactly the same. Reusing the same faces and now the age. It seems a bit late to only now start complaining about things that were accepted for over a decade or 2 just because some people got older.

Why would people expect a game to change and fill their needs just because they got older? People really have this approach? What about the younger people just getting into DOA? The "characters are too young and so on" scenario can be applied to every DOA game as long as a person is 20+. Even more so before DOA5.

I'm starting to see that the positions people have are almost entirely personal rather than objective. There's nothing wrong with the complaints. Just wanted to understand why it was even a complaint to begin with. To me, the age and reusing faces complaints would be like DOA people complaining about fanservice in another game.

To me the only one that seems to want to keep talking about this is you. Lol

I don't actually get what your deal is. It's something we are familiar with, but don't necessarily approve of. I'm accepting to NiCO, but this is it. Another 18 year old and I will flip my shit.

Especially if Genfu is really out.

 

[PhoenixVFIRE]

They are both so absolutely unoriginal and disappointing in both looks and style.

Why is it too much to ask for another Chinese martial art? I'm sorry, but MMA and streetfighting styles are so damn boring. As for Nico, she's just another anime chick that's too anime-looking for DoA and has some random ass moves that will probably be called NiCOFu or some other bs...

 

[SaihateDYNAMO]

I just don't see why being 18 is such a big deal or "creepy" all of a sudden. Going off the wiki for when the characters made their debut:

Younger (18 or below)

• Ayane-16
• Kasumi-17
• Kokoro-17
• Hitomi 18

Mid (19 up to 20)

• Leifang-19

Older (21 and up)

• Mila-21
• Helena-21
• Lisa-21
• Tina-22
• Christie-24
• Nyotengu-1000+

There was 4 girls 18 or younger.


Now for DOA6 with the Nico and her group:

Younger (18 is now the minimum)

• Ayane-18
• Marie-18
• Honoka-18
• Nico-18

Mid (19 up to 20)

• Kasumi-19
• Kokoro-19
• Hitomi-20

Older (21 and up)

• Leifang-21
• Mila-21
• Helena-23
• Lisa-23
• Tina-24
• Christie-26
• Nyotengu-1000+

I don't see half the cast being 18. There are 4 girls that are 18y/o in 6 and before Marie there were 4 girls debuting as 18 or younger.


Basically what DOA always did?

Once again, the age number doesn't really matter, it's how they look. Im annoyed at the fact that they are constantly presenting girls that can pass as 16 year olds as 18 year olds (AKA barely legal), especially in NiCO's case with that new mousepad... yikes. Marie, Honoka, Luna, and now NiCO is four already in such a short time and I'm being a little kind on Misaki. The 18-and-younger new girls never used to look so young which is the point I'm trying to make at least. Besides Nyo when was the last time an 18 year old female newcomer looked legal?

Nyo needs to be grouped with the 18 year olds btw. You know what TN was trying to do by making her 1018.

 

[Sotherius]

As for Nico, she's just another anime chick that's too anime-looking for DoA and has some random ass moves that will probably be called NiCOFu or some other bs...

Kinda late on that one, since NiCO is pencak silat, and absurdly enough, she actually has pencak silat moves on her toolkit, just with lightinings and teleports.

Anyways, my opinion on both characters.

Diego is cool, his moveset is the closest we can get to Kiryu without actually getting Kiryu. American character with roots from latin america countries, cool design, i like his scars, shirt is generic, but i didn't saw anyone complain about the "bonita" shirt that laura has on SFV (that is way more generic and makes way less sense).

NiCO, Nico has some clever stuff about her design as pointed out by other members in her thread. Her moveset also looks fun. Blue hair, i'm not against it, we already have natural purple since doa 1, then we got natural white, and natural pink. DOA was always anime, and it will still be. But her design doesn't appeal to me much, i don't find she particularly awesome. To the point that she is just a reference to some anime just like Honoka is... Well... that is probably 100% true, but Kasumi was also just Mai Shiranui with different colors when she was first made. So i'm holding any real opinions on both as characters before i see how they are developed as i'm still holding out on that side for marie, Nyotengu and Honoka for years now.

But i think both are solid designs, both fit in what DOA stablished as rules for its world and what is possible inside of it, without stretching or anything like that.

 

[human013]

To me the only one that seems to want to keep talking about this is you. Lol

I'm sure I said something along the lines of...

Carry on though. I think I got the picture.

... before.

I don't actually get what your deal is. It's something we are familiar with,

It's pretty simple. As you said, people were familiar with it and the ages were known for over a decade, but it is only now that things are getting creepy because of some 18y/o so I was just wondering why age is suddenly an issue.

but don't necessarily approve of.

As I said before, I got the picture.

 

[Tyaren]

Both character designs are very unoriginal. You have the feeling you've seen both a dozen times in other games/anime/manga before.
I really dislike the general direction in basically all fighting games to design new characters following current trends and pandering to a very specific group of fans. This always leads to unoriginal, overdesigned characters that look very soon very dated and that a small portion of the players may love, but a bigger portion dislikes.
If you look at the designs of veterans in long established fighting game series, you'll notice they all have a rather simple yet eye catching and thus memorable design. Their design stands the test of time.
I'll never be able to remember all the belts, buttons and hair pins of NiCO. Also, what's up with her name? Why is it written in such a pretentious and stupid way? On principle I'll only refer to her as simply "Nico" from now on.

 

[Sotherius]

Also, what's up with her name?

Nickel Carbonate I believe is the reason, someone pointed out somewhere else. Also, i'm not sure what you mean by veterans having memorable designs, i can think of some, but is not the general case thinking of old FG franchises.

 

[Atahotaku]

Nickel Carbonate I believe is the reason, someone pointed out somewhere else. Also, i'm not sure what you mean by veterans having memorable designs, i can think of some, but is not the general case thinking of old FG franchises.

Akira Yuuki and Ryu are very similar, for instance.

I really like the designs from Arc System Works, specially in Guilty Gear, and more accurately in Xrd and the later installments.

 

[Juihau]

Also, what's up with her name? Why is it written in such a pretentious and stupid way? On principle I'll only refer to her as simply "Nico" from now on.

From @NewWestFan in the Nico thread

Her name is the chemical formula for Nickel Carbonate which is used in the production of some batteries, obviously for plating ceramics, the production of some electronic components, and is a viable conductor of heat and electricity. When used for these purposes the combined compounds range from bright green to, you guessed it, the blue from her color palette.

Lmfao and I just noticed her eyes are Green the other end of the Nickel Carbonate compound color spectrum. Yeah this isn't accidental lmaoooooo

Personally, though, I'm kind of indifferent to the both of them. I guess with the exception that I think Nico looks weird with her glasses. I don't know, I guess those glasses are the breaking point to me where I'm just like "No, this is too much, you look silly."

 

[Truth]

Both generic. There is no saving Nico without making her an adult.

Diego was sold short by being made American. Some latino flare would have went a LONG way.

 

[Truth]

Older (21 and up)

• Leifang-21
• Mila-21
• Helena-23
• Lisa-23
• Tina-24
• Christie-26
• Nyotengu-1000+

Helena 23? Japan clearly has some cultural issues about women and age.

 

[deathofaninja]

Helena 23? Japan clearly has some cultural issues about women and age.

Well I think he's also trying to make a case that just doesn't make sense: Hey look at all these characters that AREN'T 18!...You realize there are 30s and 40s and 50s, right?

Anyway, I still don't think anyone is making a huge deal out of it, but him. And he doesn't really have a case.

 

[Onryoki]

Helena 23? Japan clearly has some cultural issues about women and age.

They don’t really have “cultural issues” the eastern culture prefers young and cute over mature and sexy. Look at Marie Rose and Honoka, the Japanese love them because they’re young and cute, characters like Tina and Rachel are far more popular because they’re more mature and sexy. Compare Japanese music videos with western music videos and you’ll clearly see the differences. It’s not a cultural issue, it’s just a cultural difference. People tend to forget that Japan has a different culture than USA and some parts of Europe.

 

[deathofaninja]

What he's insinuating is that Team NINJA will make a character look older and then slap them with a 22 or 23 or 24 even though they look 30.

The ages that were selected in DOA make about as much sense as the weight classes in DOA5.

 

[Onryoki]

What he's insinuating is that Team NINJA will make a character look older and then slap them with a 22 or 23 or 24 even though they look 30.

The ages that were selected in DOA make about as much sense as the weight classes in DOA5.

Well, some people look older than their age and some look younger than their age. I’m 21 but I look like 16, so I don’t really see the point of his insinuation. In the end my argument still stands, there’s no cultural issue, just a cultural difference that people need to get over. The Japanese love cute and the west loves sexy, period.

 

[deathofaninja]

What I'm trying to say is that Japanese will always sell their characters as young even if they aren't cute or look sexy. I don't think it's a healthy business practice, but it is what it is. There isn't a big difference in looks between 21-16, btw... but when you hit 25 (in just a few years) you will start to see a difference. Thankfully I use a lot of moisturizer.

 

[SaihateDYNAMO]

i'll add to that and say that the first time i saw helena i thought she was 29 or something. she has such an experienced look to her to the point where i can't connect early 20s to her. same with christie and lisa. just about every one of the older women in this series could use an extra 5 years added on to their ages to make sense, especially after the DOA5 facelift. japanese people reallllly favor young women over mature ones, they're really scared of aging, especially when it comes to girls.

 

[deathofaninja]

i'll add to that and say that the first time i saw helena i thought she was 29 or something. she has such an experienced look to her to the point where i can't connect early 20s to her. same with christie and lisa. just about every one of the older women in this series could use an extra 5 years added on to their ages to make sense, especially after the DOA5 facelift. japanese people reallllly favor young women over mature ones, they're really scared of aging, especially when it comes to girls.

And I think that message is a far worse one to send to anyone rather than making a big deal of girls frolicking around in bikinis.

 

[Truth]

They don’t really have “cultural issues” the eastern culture prefers young and cute over mature and sexy. Look at Marie Rose and Honoka, the Japanese love them because they’re young and cute, characters like Tina and Rachel are far more popular because they’re more mature and sexy. Compare Japanese music videos with western music videos and you’ll clearly see the differences. It’s not a cultural issue, it’s just a cultural difference. People tend to forget that Japan has a different culture than USA and some parts of Europe.

They don’t really have “cultural issues” the eastern culture prefers young and cute over mature and sexy. Look at Marie Rose and Honoka, the Japanese love them because they’re young and cute, characters like Tina and Rachel are far more popular because they’re more mature and sexy. Compare Japanese music videos with western music videos and you’ll clearly see the differences. It’s not a cultural issue, it’s just a cultural difference. People tend to forget that Japan has a different culture than USA and some parts of Europe.

Except being in your mid 20s (like Tina) doesn’t make you mature. Japan’s obsession with young women is not alien at all, the west has the same issue but to a lesser extent. And we have come a long way. For example you can find a printed magazine in the early 2000s/late 90s mocking Madonna with the caption “calm down grandma” in regards to some of her tour photos where she is expressing her sexuality. She was in her early 30s at the time. Such an article could never be written about Beyoncé/Britney/Gaga in this day and age, it’s unfathomable. However the idea that a woman’s value depreciates as she gets older is still a widespread global issue. It’s just japan has it worst.
Didn’t they create all of those female mimmick characters in Soul Calibur V, because taki, sophitia, and xanghua would be “too old” for the timeline? But they kept all the men like mitsirugi, Raphael, seifried despite them being even older. God forbid a woman is allowed to exist past the age of 30. It’s ridiculous that a woman as poised and established as Helena would be only 23.