"Promise me, you won't tell anyone" Honoka General Discussion
- Thread starter Jyakotu
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Koyomi Araragi
Member
Yeah in that scenario I agree 6T is simply a better option. I know it puts me at a big disadvantage but its been working well, they freeze up at least expecting P+K P but I understand where you're coming from it is really risky. It actually isn't what was underlined that is getting me counter poked. It's just me throwing out 6P and it ends up hitting but not on counter so I'm at -8 and get hit for trying to jab, that and my PP attempts.
At least I was right about the 9P strings, your posts have been really helpful though, as a Honoka player I appreciate them. I'll be wary on throwing 8H+K out there
FatalxInnocence
Well-Known Member
Honoka is fine. She could be better, but so could a fair amount of the cast. My only issue with her so far is initializing a stun so I can go into stance pressure/mix ups.
She is pretty bad when vsing someone with a solid defense. But 6T kinda forces defensive players to strike, counter, risk a crouch or guard. Which gives her a boat load of CH opportunities.
I do hope they change the properties of her 6k2k though... that ch knockdown is so frustrating... wish it was more like Marie's 6k2k on ch.
Key to Honoka imo is string canceling and string delaying. If you don't do that, you're gonna have issues. Her strings on block are severely one way.
And remember, 6T is Honoka's best friend.
( day 3 opinion! See if it changes as time goes by. )
She is pretty bad when vsing someone with a solid defense. But 6T kinda forces defensive players to strike, counter, risk a crouch or guard. Which gives her a boat load of CH opportunities.
I do hope they change the properties of her 6k2k though... that ch knockdown is so frustrating... wish it was more like Marie's 6k2k on ch.
Key to Honoka imo is string canceling and string delaying. If you don't do that, you're gonna have issues. Her strings on block are severely one way.
And remember, 6T is Honoka's best friend.
( day 3 opinion! See if it changes as time goes by. )
NightAntilli
Well-Known Member
As I said in another thread, if they are blocking within a certain range, you have an easy way to break their defenses.
Setup I came up with;
( guard break on blocking opponent), BT , BT
BT is guaranteed. That setup is really deadly. After it you have a lot of options.
Use BT, then BT (Launch), , , DS , (72 dmg). Alternative finisher can be (with and pressed at the same time) 76 dmg. Does more damage but is harder to execute.
Use BT to go into her stance that will allow her to either burst with , launch with , or grab for the throw into the air for a juggle.
Directly launch with or if they start holding the high .
Setup I came up with;
( guard break on blocking opponent), BT , BT BT
is guaranteed. That setup is really deadly. After it you have a lot of options.Use BT
, then BT (Launch), , , DS , (72 dmg). Alternative finisher can be (with and pressed at the same time) 76 dmg. Does more damage but is harder to execute.Use BT
to go into her stance that will allow her to either burst with , launch with , or grab for the throw into the air for a juggle.Directly launch with
or if they start holding the high .
FatalxInnocence
Well-Known Member
Yeah... this is pretty much why I don't use that move. People either dash back out of it or mid punch CH me... too risky. Doesn't help that she has no variants in it, and that like you said- she can't cancel out of it.
NightAntilli
Well-Known Member
Yeah true. But people still fall for it if you set it up correctly But other than that, 9PP2KP is a good one to break guards also. Considering she also has the fastest punches in the game at i9 for high and i11 for mid, neutral stuff like 46P are actually great for pressure.
But other than that, 9PP2KP is a good one to break guards also. Considering she also has the fastest punches in the game at i9 for high and i11 for mid, neutral stuff like 46P are actually great for pressure.
Lady Tengu
Well-Known Member
Honokas Ninja Costume!
FatalxInnocence
Well-Known Member
1KK is useless. -8 on slowest stagger escape and that's on a CH. Using this at a wall and getting a CH still grants the person a free 6T lol. It's going to make doing 1KK the only option... and stopping after 1K is -10 on it's own... sigh. Makes me wonder if somebody tried to OH after 1K would it beat out the 1K2K, and would it also register as a throw punish for 1K on block? I mean you don't even have to worry about 1KK because on CH like I said on slowest SE it's -8 so you can throw punish either way.
ailingeternity
Active Member
Just picked up Honoka and she's epic. Her mixup potential is off the hook. If you manage to land any of her stuns into Hissatsu, her damage options are very good, I've understood most of her gameplay already.
, any string she has from that move is also useless, and are infintely better, if you're asking me it's for panty shots...
Anybody care to tell me why is so good? I've seen a lot of people mention it, sorry if it's old news.
It's a direct copy of Lisa's
, any string she has from that move is also useless, and are infintely better, if you're asking me it's for panty shots...Anybody care to tell me why
is so good? I've seen a lot of people mention it, sorry if it's old news.
Saber
Well-Known Member
+8 frame advantage after the throw. It's a pressure/mixup move. You can practically throw out any move 18i and below and it will not be beat out by other moves. If they block, you get more 6T. If you try to hit, you'll get CH instead and be put in stun.Anybody care to tell me why
If your opponent knows how to fuzzy guard though then the move's useless. Like every reset throw.
I wish she could have an OH to frame trap after it but oh well.
Finally started playing Honoka. A few things that noticed:
A lot of combos (juggle combos) are malleable due to having so many moves at once within her move set. Offensively, she can be relatively versatile. I also notice that she may not be able to go into some of the stances without conducting an attack first. As if to say, the player would have to use the stances while instigating/taking advantage of the stun (Honoka has to do a move that "leaves" her in some of the stances). Playing Honoka kind of reminds me of playing Chin in KOFXIII. Because, Chin has a somewhat lengthy move set like Honoka does. He also becomes very lethal from up close because the mix ups that ensue at those ranges. Honoka needs to be careful around characters with quicker strikes as well...
Still trying to figure some other things out.
A lot of combos (juggle combos) are malleable due to having so many moves at once within her move set. Offensively, she can be relatively versatile. I also notice that she may not be able to go into some of the stances without conducting an attack first. As if to say, the player would have to use the stances while instigating/taking advantage of the stun (Honoka has to do a move that "leaves" her in some of the stances). Playing Honoka kind of reminds me of playing Chin in KOFXIII. Because, Chin has a somewhat lengthy move set like Honoka does. He also becomes very lethal from up close because the mix ups that ensue at those ranges. Honoka needs to be careful around characters with quicker strikes as well...
Still trying to figure some other things out.
Saber
Well-Known Member
Most of Honoka's stance transitions only activate on hit. And on hit she's FORCED to transition into stance. The only stance where she choose whether or not to go into is Zack's Ducking stance (4K2 and PP2, except for Airwalk, of course), and to an extent Bokuho and Dokuritsu-Ho since you can cancel out of it. This really limits the usefulness of some moves which could have otherwise been essential to her toolset (specifically moves which utilize Dragon, Heichu and HNK stances - if only 66P+K and 8P could be like Kokoro's instead of the sucky version of it, never mind that the range on Honoka's version is terrible compared to Kokoro's).
Honoka's big issue is that she has to stun the opponent. She has excellent stun-launch damage comparable to Momiji's (sometimes getting even more damage), but her range puts her at a severe disadvantage. Like Kasumi, she has to fish for CHs, but unlike Kasumi, Honoka doesn't have the string mixups to comfortably keep them up close even when they're blocking. She's more easily punishable than Kasumi and has little to no tracking options in string.
Honoka's big issue is that she has to stun the opponent. She has excellent stun-launch damage comparable to Momiji's (sometimes getting even more damage), but her range puts her at a severe disadvantage. Like Kasumi, she has to fish for CHs, but unlike Kasumi, Honoka doesn't have the string mixups to comfortably keep them up close even when they're blocking. She's more easily punishable than Kasumi and has little to no tracking options in string.
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Koyomi Araragi
Member
I completely agree with everything said here. I've used Honoka a little over 400 times online already and I'm still having trouble getting that initial stun. Out of the few characters I use, I feel I always have to put in so much effort to pull off a win with her in particular. I have an easier time with Phase 4 which I picked up roughly around the same time. I've never taken advantage of frames so much until I started using her, all those GBs and how 4K is -1 on block, It kinda feels like you need to know her frames to even stand a chance on top of knowing the range on her attacks, she appears versatile at first but in many situations you have like 3 options that will actually reach after that initial stun, for example stunning at tip range with 4K. I've dropped so many stuns because of moves just barely whiffing. It's been happening less frequently which is a good sign.
KwonJigglypuff
Well-Known Member
Okay so after playing Honoka for the first time, I really like her.
I like the concept of incorporating character's moves in several stances. I want more!
What things would you change or add for Honoka ?
- It's a shame for instance she doesn't have Mila's or Marie's moves.
- Also it seems hard to use both of her HNK throws. Very situational.
- I don't like that some properties were unchanged (Jann Lee's unblockable 236K)
I like the concept of incorporating character's moves in several stances. I want more!
What things would you change or add for Honoka ?
- It's a shame for instance she doesn't have Mila's or Marie's moves.
- Also it seems hard to use both of her HNK throws. Very situational.
- I don't like that some properties were unchanged (Jann Lee's unblockable 236K)
AsheMann21
Well-Known Member
I too have recently bought Honoka. I have to say, it's pretty overwhelming for me to adjust between a handful of stances though. My mains have like a max of 2 while she has like, 7? haha.
KwonJigglypuff
Well-Known Member
Isn't it frustrating for you guys, sometimes, not to be able to do some moves ? Like.. sometimes I'm playing with Honoka, and I forgot it's her and I want to use Helena's options from BKO (ducking for instance).. and I'm just like "wtf brain, get used to her..."
FreeStepDutch
Member
I'm really bad and new to DOA5 so take everything with a grain of salt, but really I've tried to main Honoka and I'm not having much luck. I mained Helena before so I find her lack of decent low-mid mixups frustrating in comparison, only 6K2K and 9PPKP are any good, so basically block standing her is enough other than 6T, but it's not big damage and guessing can get you so much. I have huge problems to get out of pressure when attacked, 6P is her best tool but fails a lot, her high crush 214 P+K is almost useless imho, only 1K helps, 2p works sometimes but seems unreliable, maybe I'm biased with the amazing Helena's 1pp that can get you out of pressure easily, and for some reason it seems that whatever I throw can be countered easily at any range.
As an Helena player I don't like the options they have given her, I wish that on BKH you had 6K or sweep instead of neutral K, which is really short range and forces knee stance (I don't remember the name right now sorry). It's a pity because pp2k is great but her options on BKH leave a lot to be desired.
So you have to work incredibly hard to get damage and stuns, yet her damage is nothing extraordinary, and she has lots of tools but I find it hard to take advantage of them.
When you first use her she seems like a candy shop of great moves from other chars, however after some time I think I can't see the proper way to play her, I'm about 50 hours on PS4 mostly with her, I think I've tried most of her tools but at this point I can't see how to make her work.
As an Helena player I don't like the options they have given her, I wish that on BKH you had 6K or sweep instead of neutral K, which is really short range and forces knee stance (I don't remember the name right now sorry). It's a pity because pp2k is great but her options on BKH leave a lot to be desired.
So you have to work incredibly hard to get damage and stuns, yet her damage is nothing extraordinary, and she has lots of tools but I find it hard to take advantage of them.
When you first use her she seems like a candy shop of great moves from other chars, however after some time I think I can't see the proper way to play her, I'm about 50 hours on PS4 mostly with her, I think I've tried most of her tools but at this point I can't see how to make her work.
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