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Post Launch Lisa General Discussion

NewWestFan

NewWestFan

Well-Known Member
Premium Donor
Lisa has been my go to character since I can remember. In 5 she and Tina were all I played and I got compliments from some people that made me proud of my progress with her.

6 Hits and all of a sudden it's... Different. And I can't place it but she just doesn't feel as good to me. Maybe I'm wrong? I would love some feedback. For the moment I've benched her in exchange for training up Hitomi but I know I will eventually pull her back out.
 
prototypetom

prototypetom

Active Member
Personally I feel a bit better with her in the current balance - I was missing one of the lower pressure strings I think... but I've forgotten it already (why I'll never be great at this game - no memory!). And I guess some of the stun stuff, but that was never a focus for me because... I had to remember stuff :D .

I played a Lisa yesterday who was just spamming 6KKK or whatever it is, and i got all flustered by it and kept screwing up the holds! So I have had some weird moments with her too.

But still in love (with the moveset and style - not the costumes!)

I am trying to work out who second atm. I lean towards Christie normally, but seems like Hayate
might have a moveset that makes instinctive sense to me like Lisa's. I love how the Quest thing is giving me the chnace to experiment with other characters while having another objective.
 
NewWestFan

NewWestFan

Well-Known Member
Premium Donor
prototypetom said:
Personally I feel a bit better with her in the current balance - I was missing one of the lower pressure strings I think... but I've forgotten it already (why I'll never be great at this game - no memory!). And I guess some of the stun stuff, but that was never a focus for me because... I had to remember stuff :D .

I played a Lisa yesterday who was just spamming 6KKK or whatever it is, and i got all flustered by it and kept screwing up the holds! So I have had some weird moments with her too.

But still in love (with the moveset and style - not the costumes!)

I am trying to work out who second atm. I lean towards Christie normally, but seems like Hayate
might have a moveset that makes instinctive sense to me like Lisa's. I love how the Quest thing is giving me the chnace to experiment with other characters while having another objective.
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Lisa is a ton of fun to just do random stuff with it's true. She's just slippery enough for most of it to work if you don't get predictable.
UpSideDownGRUNT said:
She probably feels weird because this is literally her first game without the stun game. She doesn't stun deep anymore and launch heights are different.
Click to expand...
I think this is it. Thank you for putting words to it. This game really forces her to lay on that pseudo striker pseudo grappler thing she has going on and for me it just winds up feeling like... I should just play a Striker, or a Grappler, becasuse they do it better.

Still my favorite character design wise.
 
Tyaren

Tyaren

Well-Known Member
Standard Donor
You are just sensing that this "Lisa" is actually not the real Lisa, but an impostor pretending to be her. The real Lisa died in the laboratory explosion. Even in story mode they simply glossed over the event and how she supposedly survived. Kinda creepy when you think about it? >__>'
 
NewWestFan

NewWestFan

Well-Known Member
Premium Donor
Tyaren said:
You are just sensing that this "Lisa" is actually not the real Lisa, but an impostor pretending to be her. The real Lisa died in the laboratory explosion. Even in story mode they simply glossed over the event and how she supposedly survived. Kinda creepy when you think about it? >__>'
Click to expand...
bitch-slap-gif-15.gif
 
Vigoorian King

Vigoorian King

Well-Known Member
Lisa was my secondary character in DOA5 and I thought that she would become my main now that Rachel is gone, but idk... using her is not as enjoyable as it used to be. Her new moves were all great additions though.
 
SaihateDYNAMO

SaihateDYNAMO

Well-Known Member
The weirdest thing about Lisa in this game is the timing it takes to get her Carrera air throw to work. The distance doesn't seem natural at all and it only works at really specific heights. If i'm too close or too far it will miss.

Another problem is that maneuvering around the opponent when they're on the ground is kinda strange now imo. In DOA5 I used to use either BT 6T or 8T to hop over a grounded opponent but now it's like they slowed the move now so it always gets stuffed. Not a big deal but her BT 6T was my favorite move to use to mess around with my opponents.

Otherwise she feels like good ol Lisa.
 
NewWestFan

NewWestFan

Well-Known Member
Premium Donor
SaihateDYNAMO said:
The weirdest thing about Lisa in this game is the timing it takes to get her Carrera air throw to work. The distance doesn't seem natural at all and it only works at really specific heights. If i'm too close or too far it will miss.

Another problem is that maneuvering around the opponent when they're on the ground is kinda strange now imo. In DOA5 I used to use either BT 6T or 8T to hop over a grounded opponent but now it's like they slowed the move now so it always gets stuffed. Not a big deal but her BT 6T was my favorite move to use to mess around with my opponents.

Otherwise she feels like good ol Lisa.
Click to expand...
After coming back to Lisa I figured this out. It's the same shenanigans as before with her but you have to dedicate. If you know they're going to wakeup kick at all you can 8T over them as soon as they hit the ground and they won't auto track and hit you so you can BT 4P+K into them and start the madness again. The counter for this is the same as it was in 5 and I've found that using 8T on Oki isn't viable after a certain skill level because it "Is" slower than it was in 5 so the punishment for it now is... Basically full combo for characters like Ayane.

Has anyone found any ways into her bound other than getting a lucky 9K CH on a jumping move or 6P4PP 6H+K? I know that her 6H+K is her Fatal Stun (9K is as well on counter hit making it my preferred Oki move just like in 5 especially if you space it well so that if they get up into block you get the frames from max reach on block) so it's the followup on breakables but I haven't found anything particularly useful on bound with her other than the obvious BB/BB cancel for relaunch.

What exactly are her meterless options on bound? I'm definitely labbing this tonight.

Edit: Oh and another note on her 8T Oki and it's lack of viability end game. I recall a match last night (That I should have recorded honestly) where I met up against an A+ Ayane, really really good player. Knew the Lisa matchup so well that I literally couldn't do anything correct. Squeezed one round out of 7 played off and that was laborious as all hell. Anyway. She fell for the 8T Oki once. Next time I tried it before Lisa was even out of her recovery frames from it Ayane was already back on her feet and going to town on my back for a guaranteed BB cancel combo that took me from 2/3 to 0 so fast all I could do was take a sip of my drink. Just be careful with it lmao

It still works but it's about as safe as doing her KKK on block.
 
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prototypetom

prototypetom

Active Member
Ayane's been almost a foregone conclusion matchup for me. I'm playing lower in the pecking order but it's gruesome seeing my normally viable mix of pressure and move become milk and cookies for half decent players.

I fixed up my busa matchup (somewhat), now this bint is my new lego brick to stand on. :confused:
 
NewWestFan

NewWestFan

Well-Known Member
Premium Donor
It's rough because Lisa wants to CH in on you from mid-close to mid range and start her mix-ups into launcher but Ayane... Is objectively better at what Lisa wants to do with better frames and options. You can really feel the speed gap in this matchup especially and it makes it feel like she can/will punish your mistakes much harder than you're capable of punishing hers. Ayane and Jahn Lee.
Jahn Lee doesn't have to give a crap what you're doing because he's able to control the space Lisa wants to be in, or just outright destroy anything in it if he doesn't feel like dealing with it.
 
WAZAAAAA

WAZAAAAA

Well-Known Member
Found a Lisa bug and some busted body splash tech.


- 5P+K and 8P+K are the same exact attack, except 8P+K is hold-resistant!
This is for both DOA5LR and DOA6.

- Her body splash is pretty strong, and I found a way to land it with "unholdable" timing in some kind of cheeky loop:
1. BT 8P+K
2. PP4
After any blocked body splash (the versions that give you a guaranteed followup), PP4 will hit the opponent giving you just the right frame advantage for the next body splash to land with unholdable timing, meaning that the opponent can't do buffered side steps or break holds. Blocking forever will result in unblockable damage. And the body splash itself is hold-resistant so it might be harder to punish "on hold".
NOTE: why press 8P+K instead of just P+K? The real input is indeed P+K, but you might as well press 8P+K while you're at it, because maybe you'll get to do the "ground stomp" attack (strongest "stomp" in the game btw) just in case the opponent stays on the ground for too long.

This is only for DOA6, because in DOA5LR even the slightest amount of Stagger Escape will nullify this.
 
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WAZAAAAA

WAZAAAAA

Well-Known Member
Best moves (on paper) that can strike-punish Lisa 7K on block (which is a retreating animation at -18), ordered from best to worst:
Code: 
STARTUP - REACH VALUE REPORTED ON THE 17TH FRAME (LAST POSSIBLE PUNISHABLE FRAME) - MOVE - CHARACTER
14F    2.45m    236P    Raidou
16F    2.43m    66K    Kasumi
16F    2.43m    66K    Phase-4
15F    2.36m    236P    Hitomi
16F    2.36m    666P    Ryu
16F    2.35m    66P    Hayate
16F    2.32m    236P    Ayane
14F    2.30m    236P    Hayate
12F    2.19m    46P    Hitomi
14F    2.17m    66P    Kokoro
NOTES:
- none of them work when 7K is blocked at max range
- I tested all the quick long moves in the game I could think of for every character... starting to suspect this game is biased towards ninjas kek
- 66 5T is also a (universal?) punish option, but it's pretty difficult to execute and neutral throws are breakable anyway
 
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