Speculation on Things Being Toned Down.

Koompbala

Well-Known Member
Note: I'm so much out of the loop I'm not even sure if this has already been discussed.

Disclaimer: I do not work for or represent Team Ninja. This is all just speculation (but) in my opinion based off their words and actions in the past. It's telling to me that this is what they are doing as a result. I guess you could say this is about correlation equals causation. To be clear for one last time. Some of the things I say will be fact because I'll use actual things that happened in the past, in order to come up with a hypothetical conclusion. I also think it should also be pointed out. I been competing competitively since DoA4. Although my appearance has been extremely erratic throughout the years.

I'm late to the party I know, but at least I'm releasing this before 6 comes out. I seen quite a few videos and articles when 6 gameplay was revealed at E3 and people threw a fit about Kasumi wearing her battlesuit as her default costume. Shortly thereafter an interview was done where it was revealed that they were toning down the sex appeal.

In order to come up with plausible motivations we gotta look at the complaints. Complaints ranged from "they bent the knee to the outrage mob" another was "toning down is stupid, bring back the sex appeal". The remaining complaints that comes to mind "the game is being toned down!? What will happen to my big titty anime gf's and their provocative clothing???" I'll tackle these complaints one by one.

1. "They bent the knee to the outrage mob" Not necessarily and even if we weren't in these politically charged times it wouldn't of changed Team Ninjas decision and here's why..... Firstly bear with me, I'm building a timeline, which is necessary to understand the take away from this, otherwise there will be a gap. DoA4 in 06 was at EVO as a side game and since then. It hasn't been at EVO even as a side game. EVO is the largest fighting game tournament. Fun fact, despite being ostracized from the fighting game community (fgc). DoA4 was on cable even before games started being shown on ESPN. DoA4 wasn't the only one being shown on DirecTV, but it was called "Championship Gaming Series" (CGS) this happened in 2007 or 2008??? Can't remember, but the reason it was picked because of its flare and it being 60fps. So it looked good to casual eyes. If the people that started CGS understood fighting games. They would of never picked DoA, but that's another topic. Point being that's the first time DoA got any major exposure because outside of CGS. DoA was lucky if numbers hit more than 10 entrants at tournaments. The only tournaments that more than 10 was an occasional Eastern tournament or DoA in Dallas (D.I.D.) Beyond that it was your dedicated players keeping it alive at tournaments. Then DoA5 came out which resulted in some DoA4 players becoming adults as well as getting new faces playing it. Things got so good for 5 as far as tournaments went. That it was beating Soul Calibur in tournament numbers. Which that was the first time it's ever happened. You also had Tom Lee from Team Ninja, flying out to tournaments to talk with players and further grow the player base. Battle Royal circuits were made and things were good for DoA during 5's life span. It was only up until recently that esports started getting big or at least big enough to finally be shown on ESPN. Unfortunately the only fighting game big enough to shown has been Street Fighter (SF). For those not aware, just a little bit before the release of SFV it got censored that video explains why, but long story short it was due to TV standards on nudity. Going back to DoA it always got crap for being hyper sexualized and considering it was on TV even before SF. They wanted to be on TV again. That means, the sex appeal needs to be toned down for TV standards. Besides considering everyone in the fgc gave it crap for the sex appeal things needed to change. The only logical thing to do for them, was to tone things down. In hope of entering the esports scene. A good general rule to follow. Is you don't want to be the first to a trend because the first one suffers from the growing pains, but yet. It's also advisable not to be the last because the trend will have already hit it's peak. That being said DoA needed to change, so that it doesn't get left behind.

2. "toning down is stupid, bring back the sex appeal". This just got answered, but to add to this and further clear things up. An unfortunate result of wanting to enter the esports scene what Team Ninja effectively did, is piss off their fans but also. The people laughing at it, haven't stopped laughing at it. So toning things down in silence rather than coming out and being honest about it. Really hurt the reputation of the series. Unfortunately this all transpired right before big brother Sony's announcement of global censorship. If they waited a little longer on the "toning down" comments. Team Ninja could of used Sony's recent censorship announcement, as an excuse as to why they "toned things down" ha! So the fans looking to get it for the boobs and boobs alone. Have already lost interest and won't be aware of any retroactive changes unfortunately. Now only core fans will be purchasing the game as well as the ones living under a rock and haven't heard of all the press 6 got for the recent changes.

3. "The game is being toned down!? What will happen to my big titty anime gf's and their provocative clothing???" Just because a ((fighting game)) is gonna focus more on the ((fighting)) aspect. Doesn't mean they gotta stop production of the X series. Which in fact, I called it in one of Zakku Rye's video's. I believe the comment I made was before DoAX3: Scarlet got announced. Even if my timing is off, it was most certainly made before I even knew of the game. For the ones that want big bouncin' tiddies. Quit your bitchin' and support the DoAX series.

To reiterate I'm not an employee and don't speak for the company or anything. I wouldn't even consider myself a die hard fan. I would just say I'm a casual fan now. Hopefully this clears things up for the ones still in the dark and wondering what's going on. I'm looking to post this around other places so if anybody can fact check me that would be much appreciated. I'm terrible with dates.
 

deathofaninja

Well-Known Member
Premium Donor
News Team
Hello, haven't heard from you in a while! Welcome back! Most of what you say is right, but DOA5 was at EVO three times. One time as a side tournament (2014) with no stream (I attended that one), the other side tournament was streamed (2015, I think). Then there was the partnered side tournament (2018).

I keep telling people those stupid ignorant fucks on Twitter to learn how to read, but they only respond with more stupidity. Team NINJA said that it would be toned down, and it has been toned down to not look absurd. There is nothing wrong with sexy costumes and bouncing boobs, and it's going to be in the game, but there is absolutely no chance you will see the Venus show up.

As you said people are free to play the DOAX series for that type of content, but then you would have to subject yourself to playing DOAX. A series that only a fan like me could appreciate somehow got worse and then boom... what do you know after it loses gameplay elements it becomes a more popular series than ever before...

anyway I'm done ranting.
 

Rikuto

P-P-P-P-P-P-POWER!
Hello, haven't heard from you in a while! Welcome back! Most of what you say is right, but DOA5 was at EVO three times. One time as a side tournament (2014) with no stream (I attended that one), the other side tournament was streamed (2015, I think). Then there was the partnered side tournament (2018).

I keep telling people those stupid ignorant fucks on Twitter to learn how to read, but they only respond with more stupidity. Team NINJA said that it would be toned down, and it has been toned down to not look absurd. There is nothing wrong with sexy costumes and bouncing boobs, and it's going to be in the game, but there is absolutely no chance you will see the Venus show up.

As you said people are free to play the DOAX series for that type of content, but then you would have to subject yourself to playing DOAX. A series that only a fan like me could appreciate somehow got worse and then boom... what do you know after it loses gameplay elements it becomes a more popular series than ever before...

anyway I'm done ranting.

It's almost as if porn is more popular than video games.
 

Onryoki

Well-Known Member
Standard Donor
In the end we all know they’ll buy the game. They are just trolling and stirring the pot.
 

Koompbala

Well-Known Member
Hello, haven't heard from you in a while! Welcome back! Most of what you say is right, but DOA5 was at EVO three times. One time as a side tournament (2014) with no stream (I attended that one), the other side tournament was streamed (2015, I think). Then there was the partnered side tournament (2018).

I keep telling people those stupid ignorant fucks on Twitter to learn how to read, but they only respond with more stupidity. Team NINJA said that it would be toned down, and it has been toned down to not look absurd. There is nothing wrong with sexy costumes and bouncing boobs, and it's going to be in the game, but there is absolutely no chance you will see the Venus show up.

As you said people are free to play the DOAX series for that type of content, but then you would have to subject yourself to playing DOAX. A series that only a fan like me could appreciate somehow got worse and then boom... what do you know after it loses gameplay elements it becomes a more popular series than ever before...

anyway I'm done ranting.

I actually didn't forget about those 2 recent EVO side tournaments, but the reason I didn't include them because it wasn't EVO endorsed. Also I'm glad you're fighting the good fight on Twitter. I got it, but don't ever use it.

It's almost as if porn is more popular than video games.

Porn is more popular overall yes, but you got games like MK that were pioneers for violence in video games and that reputation alone has carried the game throughout the years. One could argue that DoA was the pioneer for sexualization in video games, but it has done nothing to help the game. DoAX3 doing good was the result of backlash against politics and censorship, not so much sex appeal. I actually got some friends that bought the game just to go against the censorship here in the west.
 

SoftCabbage

Well-Known Member
I think it's lame both ways. Both from TN and the community - and remember how we used to have some costume banned from DOA5 competition.

Still, indeed there are some undeniable changes to the character proportion. But the changes are still good looking and definitely fulfilling the general beauty standard. I still don't see some fugly characters , especially the females, unlike some western games out there are offering. This is also one reason why I said the community's complaint is lame and rather exaggerated it eventually becomes a meme.

At the end of the day, remember that we only read this from western media. DOA5 used to have its time of 'less sexualization' too. But then look how it grew into. To put it blatantly, it was almost like a digital girlfriend service with fictional girls.
 

Raansu

Well-Known Member
The interview from last year was a mistranslation

Nothing is being toned down.

The social media crowd reacting on demand with outrage while a game was barely 10% done is just the typical outrate from social media that should be by in large completely ignored by everyone regardless of whether its gaming/news/politics. Social media is pure cancer. The initial reaction to everything is to just be pissed off.
 

Xhominid The Demon Within

Well-Known Member
Porn is more popular overall yes, but you got games like MK that were pioneers for violence in video games and that reputation alone has carried the game throughout the years. One could argue that DoA was the pioneer for sexualization in video games, but it has done nothing to help the game. DoAX3 doing good was the result of backlash against politics and censorship, not so much sex appeal. I actually got some friends that bought the game just to go against the censorship here in the west.

HAHAHAHA.... No.
There are many, MANY other candidates for the pioneer of sexualization in video games. Dead or Alive only was with jiggle physics... and even THAT was inspired by Mai Shiranui's attention to detail by the artists and sprite workers to emulate her breasts jiggling.
You have the MANY porn games made on Atari including stuff like Custer's Revenge, you have the Leisure Suit Larry series, I can go on and on but the point still stands.

You have to be born in this decade AND stupidly believe everything without trying to look for yourself to believe Dead or Alive is the pioneer in anything sexualization related.
 

Baji Breakdancer

Well-Known Member
HAHAHAHA.... No.
There are many, MANY other candidates for the pioneer of sexualization in video games. Dead or Alive only was with jiggle physics... and even THAT was inspired by Mai Shiranui's attention to detail by the artists and sprite workers to emulate her breasts jiggling.
You have the MANY porn games made on Atari including stuff like Custer's Revenge, you have the Leisure Suit Larry series, I can go on and on but the point still stands.

You have to be born in this decade AND stupidly believe everything without trying to look for yourself to believe Dead or Alive is the pioneer in anything sexualization related.
Yeah DOA was actually a pioneer in a lot of fighting game mechanics like the counter system and the implementation of danger zones. Not so much in the sexuality department. Heck, DOA was relatively tame for a 90s game. The only "sexy" thing about it was that boobs bounced, but this was already common with 2D fighters.
 

Shining_Wave

Well-Known Member
DOA perhaps pioneered character models that actually looked and felt sexy in-game and not clunky geometric nightmare fuel.

Prior to DOA most games could only look attractive in the cutscenes (if they were lucky.)
 

Xhominid The Demon Within

Well-Known Member
DOA perhaps pioneered character models that actually looked and felt sexy in-game and not clunky geometric nightmare fuel.

Prior to DOA most games could only look attractive in the cutscenes (if they were lucky.)

Nope, SNES and the NES surprisingly showed otherwise in a few games and areas.
Samus revealing herself in less garb in both Metroid and Super Metroid depending on how fast you clear AND how much you got during it speaks volumes. Mai even in the SNES, same with Chun Li and Cammy was also very obviously attractive as well.
And I can seriously go on and on about Black Orchid from Ki and such but you get the point.
 

Baji Breakdancer

Well-Known Member
What's funny is really it's Virtua Fighter that was more the outlier as far as sexuality, etc. go. Tonally it's a very dry game compared to its contemporaries.
 

SoftCabbage

Well-Known Member
The interview from last year was a mistranslation

Heh. Figures.

I didn't see or watch the actual interview. So I had no idea what was spoken/written in Japanese.

I wonder who did the bullshit translation this time. Definitely not the first time for me to have mistranslation case swallowed and spread into medias for people to drivel.
 

Koompbala

Well-Known Member
The interview from last year was a mistranslation

Nothing is being toned down.

The social media crowd reacting on demand with outrage while a game was barely 10% done is just the typical outrate from social media that should be by in large completely ignored by everyone regardless of whether its gaming/news/politics. Social media is pure cancer. The initial reaction to everything is to just be pissed off.

Figures it would be a mistranslation. I hate social media also, last year I got rid of Facebook. I still use messaging apps like messenger and WhatsApp but that's it. I've wiped my social media presence.

HAHAHAHA.... No.
There are many, MANY other candidates for the pioneer of sexualization in video games. Dead or Alive only was with jiggle physics... and even THAT was inspired by Mai Shiranui's attention to detail by the artists and sprite workers to emulate her breasts jiggling.
You have the MANY porn games made on Atari including stuff like Custer's Revenge, you have the Leisure Suit Larry series, I can go on and on but the point still stands.

You have to be born in this decade AND stupidly believe everything without trying to look for yourself to believe Dead or Alive is the pioneer in anything sexualization related.

I did not say anything definitive "it could be" is not an absolute statement. I'm well aware of those games, I'm in my 30s. Mortal Kombat also wasn't the first violent video game, but clearly you already know that........
 

Xhominid The Demon Within

Well-Known Member
I did not say anything definitive "it could be" is not an absolute statement. I'm well aware of those games, I'm in my 30s. Mortal Kombat also wasn't the first violent video game, but clearly you already know that........

No but it was truly the first violent video game of it's TYPE. Most videogames on that time did not have the tech that MK had which actually showed realistic human bodies being torn apart and someone's head being ripped off to the point of showing their spine too, or the dead bodies and torn off heads in The Pit stage either.

No videogame has touched the level that MK was at because otherwise, the ESRB wouldn't have been formed. The closest we had in comparison to any other game was blobs disintegrating exploding.
 
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