A Discussion of sexualised design of male/female characters

[Princeofhalcyon]

Already been going on a while i see o.o all i'll say is, no ones forcing people to look at what they dont like, and theres lots of sexy designs of men and women in games (Even if people ignore the men and only focus on the women) And plenty of people in real life like to look sexy to (wanting to look sexy and wanting sex are very different) And to tell women they cant dress how they want is actually sexist to if no ones doing it to men (which few do) And for those accusing games of promoting r*p* and sexism and violence to, they need some education cause the world was MUCH worse before games even existed, and not the reason this stuff still exists for sure, thats just horrible parts of human nature some get. If anything its only gotten better now that people have safe outlets for their fantasies. Not every person real or fictional needs to (represent) the entire race, some people just want to be themselves and not accused of trying to 'send a bad image' to whoever happens to see them. People arent so dumb that seeing one girl in a swimsuit is gonna make em think 'oh i guess all women should be in swimsuits if this one is' Some like a classy look, some like a sexy look, some like a cute look (like me) or some combination. So again if you dont like something, then just avoid it, like i do with furries and people who like memes (You think avoiding skin online is hard >>) none of these are going away. give some attention to all those side characters that dont get mentioned as 'good characters' just because they arent leads like lara croft or someone else typical. Thats all, enjoy that short story lol. Dont care if i get in trouble.

 

[Argentus]

Guns don't exist in the pokemon universe (anymore) so pedophilia and rape probably don't either

But terrorism does and if you've seen officer jenny you know that people love strippers there too!

I mean rape is rarely even mentioned in fiction even when its awkwardly obvious that's what would happen, and if it was just kids playing in the woods fine but some of the girls are...designed really jailbaity so it raises an eyebrow. like May in the spandex shorts, Misty and the ponytail girl in their daisy dukes, Dawn with the flimsy micro skirt etc etc. Its that combined with the creepy enemy trainers who ambush them in woods and dark caves. Just red flags all over the place.

I mean that doesn't always happen even in real life (this is really in poor taste of me to say but its actually surprising Kim Khardashian wasn't raped during her robbery considering the circumstances) but...could they have the girls dress a little more innocently lol? I get some real life girls dress like that, but the ones who do are the city girls, not the ones who wander wilderness by themselves.

 

[KasumiLover]

YESSS, finally someone who didn't understand that at all! I'm shocked Kim wasn't raped at all and that only her jewelry was stolen, that's just strange...

 

[Project Bokuho]

Brock has zero game when it comes to dating any of the thousand plus nurse joy's and officer jenny's. Pokemon jokes aside lol

 

[Argentus]

YESSS, finally someone who didn't understand that at all! I'm shocked Kim wasn't raped at all and that only her jewelry was stolen, that's just strange...

And don't misunderstand me, its not that I want her raped, I don't, its just really hard to believe guys who have her basically naked, tied up, a world famous celebrity known purely for being being really fuckable and they didn't do anything to her.

I mean Kim khardashians only claim to fame is everybody wants to fuck her till their legs give out, then guys spend days following her around planning a break in have her tied up and naked, then...don't do anything? It boggles the mind. She goes on to say how scared she was that she was gonna get raped and its like yeah its a mystery of the universe why you WERENT. She's not Paris Hilton where she's just claimed to be hot with nothing to back it up she has ass for days to back it up.

Again I'm glad it didn't happen just truly shocking that it didn't.


Anywahs back to Pokémon

 

[KasumiLover]

That's really true, that's pretty much what I thought would happen, I mean it's Kim after all.


But yeah on to Pokemon, I always found it strange how preteens their age just travel around without any adult supervision and encounter all these dangerous adults(Who mostly are just older men) and nothing happens despite how scanty they dress. Being a Japanese show, I think they wanted to give a bit of lolicon type fanservice but didn't realize how jarring it'd look to westerners, I mean remember the banned Pokemon beach episode? XD Misty was modeling in a bikini costume for mostly adults and she's underage...that's just weird.

And I know in shows like Avatar the Airbender they try to hide the whole rape thing but the subtext gives it away; I remember in the prison episode where Sokka tried rescuing Suki and it seemed to imply that she was sexually assaulted by her hostility and violent reaction when he tried to kiss her, which was pretty unsettling to me. And in Legend of Korra I know it's pretty obvious that Aamon taking people's bending was visually and symbolically akin to rape, or at least to me. Sorry if that was a bit off track.

 

[Princeofhalcyon]

But terrorism does and if you've seen officer jenny you know that people love strippers there too!

I mean rape is rarely even mentioned in fiction even when its awkwardly obvious that's what would happen, and if it was just kids playing in the woods fine but some of the girls are...designed really jailbaity so it raises an eyebrow. like May in the spandex shorts, Misty and the ponytail girl in their daisy dukes, Dawn with the flimsy micro skirt etc etc. Its that combined with the creepy enemy trainers who ambush them in woods and dark caves. Just red flags all over the place.

I mean that doesn't always happen even in real life (this is really in poor taste of me to say but its actually surprising Kim Khardashian wasn't raped during her robbery considering the circumstances) but...could they have the girls dress a little more innocently lol? I get some real life girls dress like that, but the ones who do are the city girls, not the ones who wander wilderness by themselves.

Its fine if thats your opinion, but despite all concerns theres been no r*pists around the world shouting POKEMON, just creeps who were always creeps. The world hasnt and isnt going to change because of a cartoons art style and characters. Look at tom and jerry, how many people who watched that grew up torturing animals because a cartoon made it look funny? Sex is always just the easy target for hate, and the real fact is, the country all this 'jail baity stuff' comes from is more civilized and organized than america in so many ways (cops included) Saw a documentary of what its like to be black in japan, and a lot have said its nice to actually feel safe being around police, cant blame loli's for police brutality. Its nowhere near a perfect country, but if they can do so well in the heart of japanese media (save for addicts hikkikomori) than its not the content thats an issue, its the people who are either born or made rotten by the real influences, family or school life or work. If any actual evidence comes up that the worlds issues are escalating because of a cartoons characters then i'll take peoples concerns seriously, but till then, its just stuff that seems like should happen but wont because the majority of people really arent that dumb that they imitate everything they see. I mean you keep mentioning pokemon, but animal cruelty is the real concern in the show lol. :3 but just like tom and jerry, kids arent making animals fight because of it, and people who do likely never even heard of pokemon. btw h i heard someone say anime characters are a bad influence because they're too skinny.. thats the level of intelligence of those kinda complaints, the ones complaining are who im most concerned about :/

 

[Argentus]

Its fine if thats your opinion, but despite all concerns theres been no r*pists around the world shouting POKEMON, just creeps who were always creeps. The world hasnt and isnt going to change because of a cartoons art style and characters. Look at tom and jerry, how many people who watched that grew up torturing animals because a cartoon made it look funny? Sex is always just the easy target for hate, and the real fact is, the country all this 'jail baity stuff' comes from is more civilized and organized than america in so many ways (cops included) Saw a documentary of what its like to be black in japan, and a lot have said its nice to actually feel safe being around police, cant blame loli's for police brutality. Its nowhere near a perfect country, but if they can do so well in the heart of japanese media (save for addicts hikkikomori) than its not the content thats an issue, its the people who are either born or made rotten by the real influences, family or school life or work. If any actual evidence comes up that the worlds issues are escalating because of a cartoons characters then i'll take peoples concerns seriously, but till then, its just stuff that seems like should happen but wont because the majority of people really arent that dumb that they imitate everything they see. I mean you keep mentioning pokemon, but animal cruelty is the real concern in the show lol. :3 but just like tom and jerry, kids arent making animals fight because of it, and people who do likely never even heard of pokemon. btw h i heard someone say anime characters are a bad influence because they're too skinny.. thats the level of intelligence of those kinda complaints, the ones complaining are who im most concerned about :/

I wasn't saying pokemon encourages real world rape.

I was pointing out that the premise of pokemon would often lead to rape in the real world. So its kind of a big pink elephant in the room while playing the game.


As for animal cruelty well yeah the show is about organized and televised cockfights lol

 

[Princeofhalcyon]

I wasn't saying pokemon encourages real world rape.

I was pointing out that the premise of pokemon would often lead to rape in the real world. So its kind of a big pink elephant in the room while playing the game.


As for animal cruelty well yeah the show is about organized and televised cockfights lol

Oh, well yeah if its just how you feel thats fine. Theres even more stuff like the fact no one ever changes their clothes to something i just hope people all try to remember is to keep personal feelings out of decisions that will effect lots of people, (stupid petitions are made of those) one reason why i don't support anti gay-marriage, theres literally no detriment to allowing them to and no logical reason they shouldn't, and the only reason people don't want it is because they think its icky. Thats the only reason lol, doesnt affect their lives at all, they're just imposing their insecurities and discomfort on people. would also like to quote Kumiko Yamada, representative of the Japanese wing of the Women’s Institute Of Contemporary Media Culture. 'The so-called sexual violence in manga and video games is a made-up thing and as such does not threaten the rights of actual people; therefore, it is meaningless in protecting the rights of women' and second 'There is nothing to be gained from regulating fictional sexual violence. However, while you’re trying to fix the rights of fictional characters, you’re leaving the human rights of real women in the real world left to rot' I looove this article because this woman just explains so well in so many ways why trying to 'save' fictional characters by banning stuff is a waste of time and won't help real people at all. Take a look at a life time show called 'dance moms' now theres something that needed to be stopped because those are real people, real mothers treating eachother like crap and their little kids that cant be more than 13 like show girls :/ and thats an american show. How did that ever get on tv? Fiction and reality are very different and all you gotta do is look at stuff like pokemon or any war game to know that,people who have actually been in war have laughed at these kinda games lol. Anyway thats it of my two cents.

 

[Chapstick]

I've literally never had the thought "this 10 y/o girl would get raped if this was irl" when playing pokemon and I'm sure 99% of the other people playing it haven't either so I don't think I'd call it an elephant in the room.

 

[Jadeinchains]

Yeah I'm kinda over the whole "what if this kids show etc was dark" thing. It's interesting to see the dark undertones of things like the pokemon tower in Lavender town and ghosts etc but I don't think it needs to get that dark for a pokemon game.

 

[Tyaren]

I've literally never had the thought "this 10 y/o girl would get raped if this was irl" when playing pokemon and I'm sure 99% of the other people playing it haven't either so I don't think I'd call it an elephant in the room.

This.

No offense Argentus but your train of thought here is imo kinda strange... and I hope out of the ordinary for most people playing these games.
Also your and KasumiLover's Kim K discussion...

everybody wants to fuck her till their legs give out

then guys spend days following her around planning a break in have her tied up and naked, then...don't do anything?

None of the reports say she was naked. That's your imagination...

 

[KasumiLover]

Yeah, Kim's hot and I love her, but I wouldn't fuck her...I mean, you know where that thing's been? XD I don't wanna screw anyone who's had a sex tape, multiple boyfriends, and was impregnated by Kanye West, no thanks.

Pokemon can be dark when it wants to be but I don't think the characters in that world really have to worry about that stuff since the creators would never go that far.

 

[Princeofhalcyon]

This.

No offense, Argentus but your train of thought here is imo kinda strange... and I hope out of the ordinary for most people playing these games.
Also your and KasumiLover's Kim K discussion...

Also none of the reports say she was naked. That's your imagination...

This.

No offense, Argentus but your train of thought here is imo kinda strange... and I hope out of the ordinary for most people playing these games.
Also your and KasumiLover's Kim K discussion...

Also none of the reports say she was naked. That's your imagination...

With some people ive seen its almost like they want the bad stuff they're concerned about to happen just so they could say i told you so or something. Its pretty weird to me.

 

[Argentus]

I've literally never had the thought "this 10 y/o girl would get raped if this was irl" when playing pokemon and I'm sure 99% of the other people playing it haven't either so I don't think I'd call it an elephant in the room.

1) they're ten?! Could swear most of then were older

2) its more me being a paranoid cynic than looking at it being "dark and edgy", is all.

This.

No offense Argentus but your train of thought here is imo kinda strange... and I hope out of the ordinary for most people playing these games.
Also your and KasumiLover's Kim K discussion...

None of the reports say she was naked. That's your imagination...

Googled it and one of the reports said she was ties up "basically naked" in the bathroom.

Again though I want to he perfectly clear I'm not saying she should have been raped, I'm NOT.

Was just noting that home invasions like that tend to end that way and it was surprising that an international sex symbol didn't end that way too.

I know its gonna make people awkward pointing it out but I study criminal psychology as a hobby so I'm used to hearing/reading about it at this point and its a lot more common than people think or like to admit. So if you really need a reason why my thought process went in that direction, that's why.

Yeah, Kim's hot and I love her, but I wouldn't fuck her...I mean, you know where that thing's been? XD I don't wanna screw anyone who's had a sex tape, multiple boyfriends, and was impregnated by Kanye West, no thanks.

Pokemon can be dark when it wants to be but I don't think the characters in that world really have to worry about that stuff since the creators would never go that far.

Really its mostly the kanye by proxy that turns people off XD

With some people ive seen its almost like they want the bad stuff they're concerned about to happen just so they could say i told you so or something. Its pretty weird to me.

FUCKING NO.

Just because I don't try to pretend it doesn't happen doesn't mean that I WANT it to happen, NO.

Girls are raped every damn day that's just a fact of life. Especially in break in robberies.

I pointed out that its surprising that an international sex symbol was not raped in a situation where the girls are commonly raped . That is ALL.

I do NOT encourage/endorse/condone/want rape AT ALL and I would appreciate it if you NEVER implied that I do, again.

I just REFUSE to turn a blind eye to what is a common crime, out of principle, so, as uncomfortable as it makes others feel, I'm not afraid to bring I up.

 

[Russian-chiropractic19]

Argentus I'm not sure why the thought was brought up in your head, but you need to keep in mind it's something that's only making sense to talk about in your head. It's an errant thought and one best left at that. there is no end game for this conversation and the longer it goes on it's going to just become increasingly akward for everyone.

It'll be great when the Halloween costumes come out then we can get back to what we do the best.

 

[Argentus]

Argentus I'm not sure why the thought was brought up in your head, but you need to keep in mind it's something that's only making sense to talk about in your head. It's an errant thought and one best left at that. there is no end game for this conversation and the longer it goes on it's going to just become increasingly akward for everyone.

It'll be great when the Halloween costumes come out then we can get back to what we do the best.

It was originally and off handed comment, the reason I'm blowing up here is because the whole "keep it to yourself/ don't talk about it/don't tell anyone/pretend it doesn't/didn't happen" mentality is a huge reason why things are so much worse than they need to be, and I have a personal investment in combatting those kind of under the rug dismissals.

The pokemon thing, I meant it half jokingly. The Kim thing is just an objective observation. People trying to act like that never happens is what's setting me off.


As for what we do best...wait for the next dlc? XD

 

[Juihau]

1) they're ten?! Could swear most of then were older

It depends on the game. If I'm not mistaken, the protagonists of the main games from gen 1 to 4 were all around 10 years old. In gens 5 and 6, they upped them to being around their mid-teens.

 

[Hayabusiness]

I always wonder how much more would DOA interest other demographics if they also amped up the male sexualization. I'm not saying it should look comical, of course. Like, maybe it could be something more on par with Rig's got; more handsome male characters, more relevance to them, more care put towards them, more outfits... Etc.
Would other people care, would it attract more players like the female characters did, or would it only alienate the current fanbase?

I lean more on the latter because I already got told off by a guy in the DOAX3 thread for saying I wanted the dudes in the game...
Especially in Japan, I can see people making a tantrum. When Idol M@ster got male idol DLC, fans wanted to boycott Jupiter (the all male idol trio) and IM@S in general.

Another thought regarding this is, if they got the same attention as the girls, guys would now be subject to lazy, ugly, OOC copypaste DLC...

Maybe there is not much to talk about what I said, but it always crosses my mind when I see the Devil Ein DLC and other outfits (like Rig's catalogue, and more recently Ryu and Hayate's. 2016 Halloween DLC).

 

[Tyaren]

I would also say DOA/DOAX3 would risk alienating a portion of it's biggest and most reliable fan base. From my experience the horniest straight males are also some of the most easily repelled and intolerant when it comes to being subjected to their own sexualized gender. That's just my experience though...so I'm not trying to generalize...
DOA has to walk a fine line by also supporting male sexualization from time to time and that is what they are actually doing. I think the valentine stuff is as far as it will ever go in that regard. But imo that's sufficent enough, isn't it? Contrary to popular belief they even had pronounced bulges...

...and bulge jiggle is completely out of the question because the equal thing would be jiggling vaginas (both primary sexual characteristics). Just mentioning this because it is so often brought up. XD