Wanted Balance Changes

[Dan]

Only 5 Characters out of 34 (85%) have a mid kick critical Burst
So when you're doing a combo with 3 counter hits and reached critical hit --it is predictable that you are going to use your CB move (which is 85% a mid punch)

I mean there's lots of things you could mix up after hitting critical hit (knowing the opponent is going to counter) like throw them for a hi counter damage or launch them at a ok height -- but it just loses a chance for a power blow I guess

I was playing with a bunch of friends and none of them can get a CB/PB on me cause its 85% mid punch. its not even guessing its just so predictable

So I say add more Mid kick Critical Bursts for the characters that needs them since they have so many mid punch move sets
So far I think Rachel, Leon, Ein, Tina needs it the most

...is there any other characters you guys would like to see to have a Mid Kick CB?

 

[KING JAIMY]

Only 5 Characters out of 34 (85%) have a mid kick critical Burst
So when you're doing a combo with 3 counter hits and reached critical hit --it is predictable that you are going to use your CB move (which is 85% a mid punch)

I mean there's lots of things you could mix up after hitting critical hit (knowing the opponent is going to counter) like throw them for a hi counter damage or launch them at a ok height -- but it just loses a chance for a power blow I guess

I was playing with a bunch of friends and none of them can get a CB/PB on me cause its 85% mid punch. its not even guessing its just so predictable

So I say add more Mid kick Critical Bursts for the characters that needs them since they have so many mid punch move sets
So far I think Rachel, Leon, Ein, Tina needs it the most

...is there any other characters you guys would like to see to have a Mid Kick CB?

I personally don't use the Critical Burst a lot as I want to stay unpredictable and if I do, I usually delay if I expect my opponent to hold so I can hit them in their recovery frames. Or I instantly launch them because Cr. Stun level 3 gives the same launch height as launching after a CB.

Regarding giving other characters mid kick CB's, I'm not too sure if that would help the character balancing. Sure Alpha has 3 CB's on different hit levels but that can be justified by the fact that she is geared towards offense. So perhaps they could give offensive character a mid kick CB? Also, why do you think Rachel, Leon, Ein and Tina are the characters who need a mid kick CB?

 

[Dan]

I personally don't use the Critical Burst a lot as I want to stay unpredictable and if I do, I usually delay if I expect my opponent to hold so I can hit them in their recovery frames. Or I instantly launch them because Cr. Stun level 3 gives the same launch height as launching after a CB.

Regarding giving other characters mid kick CB's, I'm not too sure if that would help the character balancing. Sure Alpha has 3 CB's on different hit levels but that can be justified by the fact that she is geared towards offense. So perhaps they could give offensive character a mid kick CB? Also, why do you think Rachel, Leon, Ein and Tina are the characters who need a mid kick CB?

Launching at Cr. Stun Level 3 is not the same height after doing a CB.
I checked the move details on the height (On counter hit) with Hitomi/ Jann Lee
For Hitomi, Doing 9K on the 4th hit will lunch at 1.48m but doing 9k after CB as the 5th attack will launch at 1.54m
For Jann Lee, Doing 9K on the 4th hit will lunch at 1.89m but doing 9k after CB as the 5th attack will launch at 2.00m

When the first DOA5 came out, Ayane didn't have a Mid Kick CB and Lisa didn't have a mid punch CB then then they give them one after an update and it really felt it added more mix ups

I chose:
Rachel because she has alot of mid punches and that gets her counter alot and her 9k does not launch very high and her 4H+K leaves her back turned.
Leon because if someone wants to do a combo the 4th hit is either mid punch CB then launch or the 4th hit is 213P which is another Mid Punch (I am also aware he could just wait for the oppenent to counter and he can just counter throw but I'm really trying to raise the chances of Leon and other characters to land a Power Blow animation)
Tina should get a Back Turned Mid Kick CB. Lisa has a back turned CB after a past update and now its one her main uses in her combo and I think it would really work well with Tina too
Ein - I do not have much to say about Ein but they did bring him back and now no one really uses him? his move list seems short and outdated?

the main concern of all this is that I want to see more critical Bursts (which leads to more Power blows & power launchers) to happen more often but that can't happen if 85% of character's CB are Mid Punch and are easily counter'd. So by giving more (but not all) a Mid Kick CB would increase the chances

 

[KING JAIMY]

Launching at Cr. Stun Level 3 is not the same height after doing a CB.
I checked the move details on the height (On counter hit) with Hitomi/ Jann Lee
For Hitomi, Doing 9K on the 4th hit will lunch at 1.48m but doing 9k after CB as the 5th attack will launch at 1.54m
For Jann Lee, Doing 9K on the 4th hit will lunch at 1.89m but doing 9k after CB as the 5th attack will launch at 2.00m

Oh okay, my bad. You learn something new every day.

When the first DOA5 came out, Ayane didn't have a Mid Kick CB and Lisa didn't have a mid punch CB then then they give them one after an update and it really felt it added more mix ups

True that. I know for a fact that Lisa's BT 7P is a threat because it is guaranteed after her 9K. Ayane's BT 4H+K is pretty good too and it can be used at long range.

I chose:
Rachel because she has alot of mid punches and that gets her counter alot and her 9k does not launch very high and her 4H+K leaves her back turned.

Hmm... not sure if I can agree on this one. Kokoro and Gen Fu have tons of mid punches as well yet they don't have a mid kick CB. She has a few strong mid kicks such as 8K, 66K and 7K so I don't feel she needs one to be honest.

Leon because if someone wants to do a combo the 4th hit is either mid punch CB then launch or the 4th hit is 213P which is another Mid Punch (I am also aware he could just wait for the oppenent to counter and he can just counter throw but I'm really trying to raise the chances of Leon and other characters to land a Power Blow animation)

Leon's CB is pretty damn good. He can charge his CB to punish opponents' holds and get a CB on Cr. Stun Level 2. Also his P+K has a throw follow-up when fully charged. He can still launch with WR K which is a high kick to mix it up with his CB.

Tina should get a Back Turned Mid Kick CB. Lisa has a back turned CB after a past update and now its one her main uses in her combo and I think it would really work well with Tina too

Not sure what to think of it, but if they give Tina a back-turned mid kick CB, at least make it unsafe on block as her BT options are already solid as it is.

Ein - I do not have much to say about Ein but they did bring him back and now no one really uses him? his move list seems short and outdated?

Agreed. He needs to have more moves and a mid kick CB would really help him.

the main concern of all this is that I want to see more critical Bursts (which leads to more Power blows & power launchers) to happen more often but that can't happen if 85% of character's CB are Mid Punch and are easily counter'd. So by giving more (but not all) a Mid Kick CB would increase the chances

There are still several ways of landing a CB, even if your opponent is guessing correctly. One way of avoiding getting held is by delaying your CB to hit them in their recovery frames. Another way is to be creative with your setups so that your opponent won't see that CB coming. Or throw them everytime when they are going to do a mid punch hold to condition them not to hold. After you've conditioned them, chances are considerably higher they will not hold the CB because they fear getting thrown.

 

[Dan]

Hmm... not sure if I can agree on this one. Kokoro and Gen Fu have tons of mid punches as well yet they don't have a mid kick CB. She has a few strong mid kicks such as 8K, 66K and 7K so I don't feel she needs one to be honest.

but when Kokoro or Gen Fu does a 3hit critical hit on the 4th hit they can use their CB or a Mid Kick launcher that sends them into the air (at a good height) then use their combo ender. So if Rachel does a 3Hit Critical and then uses 7K, the 7K would start a new critical threshold since it is 25frames. If Rachel does a 3hit Critical and then a 66K it does a knock back of 3.50m with no follow up. If Rachel does a 3hit Critical and then a 8K does a ground bounce (which can be followed up with 213P+K,T). So what would her be best option for max damage after doing a 3hit Critical? (Its definitely not her 9k mid kick launcher). Its either her 213p or 7p which are both Mid punches.

I yeah I think giving her a mid kick CB would add more value to her. I mean she only has 65 moves and can become quite predictable once she reaches that 3rd round online

Leon's CB is pretty damn good. He can charge his CB to punish opponents' holds and get a CB on Cr. Stun Level 2. Also his P+K has a throw follow-up when fully charged. He can still launch with WR K which is a high kick to mix it up with his CB.

I didnt know he can CB on the 3rd hit if fully charged
Yeah Leon is Pretty good but I think I just put him this list because I want more people to use him online. So I figure give him more moves

Not sure what to think of it, but if they give Tina a back-turned mid kick CB, at least make it unsafe on block as her BT options are already solid as it is.

Yeah it should be like any other CB. 20frames to start up and -8 or -9 disadvantage if blocked

There are still several ways of landing a CB, even if your opponent is guessing correctly. One way of avoiding getting held is by delaying your CB to hit them in their recovery frames. Another way is to be creative with your setups so that your opponent won't see that CB coming. Or throw them everytime when they are going to do a mid punch hold to condition them not to hold. After you've conditioned them, chances are considerably higher they will not hold the CB because they fear getting thrown.

Good tip!