Sidestepping needs a buff or be removed

[Excalibur]

Side step has its uses but I think we can all agree that its still pretty far behind what it should be and its uses are extremely linear.

Good luck convincing them that is the case.

 

[Matt Ponton]

You cannot block faster than an opponents incoming attack right after sidestepping.

This is wrong, as Static did block after coming out of side step. He just attempted to do a counter poke with 6P instead of continuing to block. I can get you the screen grab of him blocking if you'd like.

But yeah, there's always improvements that can be done to the command side step. It functions even differently than it was in the beta builds where strings didn't retrack on the command sidestep so after two successful command steps in a row you were at the opponent's back. There was even a build at one time where you could back dash cancel the command step.

But saying that is different than saying the entire system should be gutted because you aren't using it to its full potential.

 

[Excalibur]

This is wrong, as Static did block after coming out of side step. He just attempted to do a counter poke with 6P instead of continuing to block. I can get you the screen grab of him blocking if you'd like.

But yeah, there's always improvements that can be done to the command side step. It functions even differently than it was in the beta builds where strings didn't retrack on the command sidestep so after two successful command steps in a row you were at the opponent's back. There was even a build at one time where you could back dash cancel the command step.

But saying that is different than saying the entire system should be gutted because you aren't using it to its full potential.

I would love for it not to retrack. If they implemented this then I would then feel SS is actually good for something beyond sidestep attack. But right now sidestepping only to have to block if you don't attack puts you back at square one.

Also, I was actually meaning to edit that "cannot block after sidestep" out. I actually was doing it in training mode by setting up the AI to strike. However, sidestepping seems to still be vulnerable to grabs or it's just the AI idk.

 

[Matt Ponton]

Yes you get counter thrown if you sidestep, just like VF where sidestep loses to throw (though you can crouch dash cancel a side step in VF).

 

[Excalibur]

So what was the reason less tracking and dash cancel was scrapped? Wouldn't these kind of things add more depth to a game?

 

[iHajinShinobi]

My last two posts explains what side step can do and how effective it can actually if you learn how to use it appropriately. Complaints about it always come from someone not doing the latter at all.

 

[Matt Ponton]

So what was the reason less tracking and dash cancel was scrapped? Wouldn't these kind of things add more depth to a game?

The players would do nothing but sidestep the entire match because it was too good and no one would throw an attack.

 

[Excalibur]

My last two posts explains what side step can do and how effective it can actually if you learn how to use it appropriately. Complaints about it always come from someone not doing the latter at all.

You haven't explained anything. All you said was sidestep and attack, then tried to make it sound more in depth by saying it can be done at the end of the string or middle of it lol. I asked you what can you do outside sidestep and attacking and you just ignored it.

Mr.Wah is the one who explained the possibilities of it or at least were going to be possible during the beta. Which now I am more inclined to think it's really not anything compared to what it can be at all. So the fact is, or so in my mind, it's nothing more than for offense as it currently stands.

 

[Excalibur]

The players would do nothing but sidestep the entire match because it was too good and no one would throw an attack.

Sigh* maybe the dash cancel then? Or is there some major downside to that too?

 

[Matt Ponton]

Sigh* maybe the dash cancel then? Or is there some major downside to that too?

That's what I was referring to. Players would just sidestep dash cancel the entire match since tracking attacks were generally slow enough to cancel into guard, and linear attacks would be sidestepped and punished with a back-turned combo.

Basically what I'm saying is, the way it is now is a design decision because they don't want it to be a primary focus on the game system as it stands in DOA5.

 

[iHajinShinobi]

You haven't explained anything. All you said was sidestep and attack, then tried to make it sound more in depth by saying it can be done at the end of the string or middle of it lol. I asked you what can you do outside sidestep and attacking and you just ignored it.

Really now, because all I've been reading from you is insisting a game mechanic is something of your opinion because you don't know how to properly use it.

Even explained what actually happened in your video example (which did not help prove any point you've tried to make in this thread so far) and further explained why said string was a bad example and gave a good example of another one.

I already said what options you have after a side step aside from a side step attack, which is to hold, block or use another move (or throw punish) when you're on defense. Some characters can use their special movement to avoid certain on block situations entirely on reaction.

Ayane can avoid Helena's BKO 6P4P with 1P+K and punish with BT 2T.

You choose not to acknowledge something because you are in disagreement with me about a mechanic you do not understand that well. You have dismissed what I told you within' my last three posts on the first page of this thread. All are accurate assessments of what happened in your video example that you are choosing not to see because of your disbelief of a game mechanic you don't know how (or choose to learn) to use well.

There is nothing more for me to say on the matter of this discussion because you are listening to what you want to hear (selective reading).

So the fact is, or so in my mind, it's nothing more than for offense as it currently stands.

No it's not a fact, it is your opinion.

 

[Excalibur]

Really now, because all I've been reading from you is insisting a game mechanic is something of your opinion because you don't know how to properly use it.

Even explained what actually happened in your video example (which did not help prove any point you've tried to make in this thread so far) and further explained why said string was a bad example and gave a good example of another one.

I already said what options you have after a side step aside from a side step attack, which is to hold, block or use another move (or throw punish) when you're on defense. Some characters can use their special movement to avoid certain on block situations entirely on reaction.

Ayane can avoid Helena's BKO 6P4P with 1P+K and punish with BT 2T.

You choose not to acknowledge something because you are in disagreement with me about a mechanic you do not understand that well. You have dismissed what I told you within' my last three posts on the first page of this thread. All are accurate assessments of what happened in your video example that you are choosing not to see because of your disbelief of a game mechanic you don't know how (or choose to learn) to use well.

There is nothing more for me to say on the matter of this discussion because you are listening to what you want to hear (selective reading).



No it's not a fact, it is your opinion.

Selective reading is only reading what you want to read. Iv read every bit of your post. Hearing has nothing to do with reading. I also said "or so in my mind" I don't think it could get more obvious it's my opinion. But we have to backtrack because your not understanding what I am asking.

I asked what other defensive capabilities does sidestep have during it. First page-last post. "So what defensive capabilities does it have outside of attacking during it are you referring to?" 4:51am This is how I know you didn't really pay attention to what I asked because you said this.

I already said what options you have after a side step aside from a side step attack, which is to hold, block or use another move (or throw punish) when you're on defense. Some characters can use their special movement to avoid certain on block situations entirely on reaction

For someone who likes to claim another person is doing some selective reading, you don't seem to pay much attention yourself. So you can try and justify this as you misread and what not, but now I know you don't pay much attention to anyone who disagrees with you lol.

 

[Excalibur]

That's what I was referring to. Players would just sidestep dash cancel the entire match since tracking attacks were generally slow enough to cancel into guard, and linear attacks would be sidestepped and punished with a back-turned combo.

Basically what I'm saying is, the way it is now is a design decision because they don't want it to be a primary focus on the game system as it stands in DOA5.

It just feels like shame is all, but thank you for the background info on the game