I dunno, I do 6PK 2K and it's always advantageous.
Rachel General Discussion
- Thread starter Kodachi
- Start date
MasterHavik
Well-Known Member
So I wanted to dig and find out if Rachel's linear issues were true. What did I find out?
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They are true. She has 11 moves that track not counting those sexy throws. What are they? Well....
1pp
ppT
4pp
ppk(last kick tracks high)
SS p
H+K
2/8P+K a.k.a Roll the P out of it tracks.
4pp2p mid low tracking string
3ppp
214p
11 out of 62 moves track not counting throws. So that's 18% of her movelist. That's not good. Welp Rachel isn't broken when SS can body her. We have to be careful and not press any buttons folks.
.
.
.
.
.
They are true. She has 11 moves that track not counting those sexy throws. What are they? Well....
1pp
ppT
4pp
ppk(last kick tracks high)
SS p
H+K
2/8P+K a.k.a Roll the P out of it tracks.
4pp2p mid low tracking string
3ppp
214p
11 out of 62 moves track not counting throws. So that's 18% of her movelist. That's not good. Welp Rachel isn't broken when SS can body her. We have to be careful and not press any buttons folks.
Drake Aldan
Well-Known Member
Ok, it's probably better if I just show you.
I'm using the computer in the example because I've given up whiffing 2K on human opponents.
That 2K. Not the stomp, which I've seen whiff coupled with a back tech before, but just the regular, generic 2K. Is that still advantage on whiff? It sure don't feel like it.
I'm using the computer in the example because I've given up whiffing 2K on human opponents.
That 2K. Not the stomp, which I've seen whiff coupled with a back tech before, but just the regular, generic 2K. Is that still advantage on whiff? It sure don't feel like it.
Drake Aldan
Well-Known Member
Ah, I see. So 6PKP is screwing it up!
Sheesh... Somebody get a combo thread in dis board pronto
MasterHavik
Well-Known Member
I'll go make one.
Is this sarcasm? You can't sidestep throws. :v
MasterHavik
Well-Known Member
not counting throws bro. SS still blows her up. I'm not joking.
I main Kokoro, man, Rachel is a queen of tracking to me. Make them afraid to poke with the OH and then just throw out more throws. And it's not like she doesn't have tracking. She has the tools to blow up side steps.
Drake Aldan
Well-Known Member
ok um
*sigh*
I thought bounds were supposed to be all the same?
It returns to normal if you take out the 6PP/use 9P instead. I guess it's not that big of a deal...
*sigh*
I thought bounds were supposed to be all the same?
It returns to normal if you take out the 6PP/use 9P instead. I guess it's not that big of a deal...
FatalxInnocence
Well-Known Member
I thought for the stomp whiff advantage you just did 9P and then stomp as they hit the ground? Hahahaha, I'm kinda just going off what I read on this page... so I'm probably not even talking about what you guys are talking about.
0:38 if you want the time stamp.
If I'm talking about something that's not being spoken about, by all means just ignore my stupid self hahahaha.
Edit; Eh! Yeah I'm confused. Isn't 2K the stomp? but people are saying 2K not the stomp... my brain hurts. I always get the stomp when I 2K after launch...
0:38 if you want the time stamp.
If I'm talking about something that's not being spoken about, by all means just ignore my stupid self hahahaha.
Edit; Eh! Yeah I'm confused. Isn't 2K the stomp? but people are saying 2K not the stomp... my brain hurts. I always get the stomp when I 2K after launch...
viol tentacule
Member
Drake Aldan
Well-Known Member
Does anyone think this is worth anything? The second hit of 1PP and 214P are basically the same thing, so... Could you possibly use 1P~214P to trick your opponent into thinking that 1PP has a huge delay/is hit-confirmable when it really isn't?
I've done it by accident a few times...
I've done it by accident a few times...
I have been playing around in Training and there is something I don't understand: Not considering Stagger Escape (because it's turn off in this case), why can't I connect 66P after using 8P in a Stun? 8P used during a Stun is supposed to have you at +21. (according to the Fight Info) 66P is 20. Yet the opponent will recover from the stun before 66P lands. I've been trying to experiment with a quick Critical Burst by doing 7K, 8K, 8P, 66P. But like I said, 66P doesn't land. I guess I could just be satisfied be with 7K, 8K, 8P, 7P into juggle.
And something really odd I discovered: Tested with Rachel vs Rachel in Training Mode: If you set the training dummy to Recovery On, then do 9K into 2K stomp, the last hit of the stomp animation will whiff. I hope this glitch would never happen in an actual fight.
And something really odd I discovered: Tested with Rachel vs Rachel in Training Mode: If you set the training dummy to Recovery On, then do 9K into 2K stomp, the last hit of the stomp animation will whiff. I hope this glitch would never happen in an actual fight.
Interesting. Even if the opponent realizes it's not the true string, they still have to respect the extra long delay.
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Drake Aldan
Well-Known Member
IIRC, when it comes to punishment, the disadvantage has to be 1 frame more than the move you're using. i.e. a 7 frame throw can only punish -8 disadvantage or more.
In stun, the disadvantage has to be 2 frames more. So, if 66P is i20, you must have at least +22 to land.
Something like that. It was confusing to me, but I guess that's just how the system works here.
It happens in certain situations, sometimes on BT opponents. Apparently the opponent can wakeup kick if the soccerball finish whiffs, but in my experience people are so scared of the blender they end up teching anyway.
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TheTHCGamer
Active Member
Rachels great when your opponent has little experience against her but when you opponent ends up playing a long session against her all that goes out the window. Linear ass character in my opinion and as I've stated slow. Her attacks and setups become predictable over time.
She also as I've also stated needs to get inside because of her poor spacing. I personally feel characters with solid mid to long range attacks expose her. I don't even feel she does or has the same damage potential compared to the majority of the cast.
It would be terrible to nerf her this early in the games life and its an insult to the developers who made this game to already be asking for nerfs. The only character I feel totally comfortable when using Rachel is Eliot.
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Drake Aldan
Well-Known Member
How are you supposed to deal with speed when you're on the inside? Holds? Sidestep? (Just chucking out a SS K has got me hit before- do you need to sidestep multiple times for strings?)
I'm about to start trolling the Bayman section to look for answers... You have to be real careful what you choose as a retaliation or you'll be eating counterhits even with advantage!
I'm about to start trolling the Bayman section to look for answers... You have to be real careful what you choose as a retaliation or you'll be eating counterhits even with advantage!
MasterHavik
Well-Known Member
Thank you. But you know no one pays attention to that. Everyone focuses on the blender.
Cylith
Member
Why do people keep saying she is slow? Only the fastest characters in the game ie: Christie, Helena, Kasumi, Ayane etc. are faster or even with her. Also to mention I'm not including standard jabs in the previous sentence since the slowest one is around 12f IIRC. Anyways,if you're fighting those characters then yeah, you can notice a difference, but that is barely even 10% of the cast.
I'm not saying she is OP, even my earlier posts never said that, but that she is a really hard fight. She DOES have reach, speed, damage, and she is a heavy weight class fighter so a lot of combos or set-ups will barely work or not at all. Since she doesn't have to pay attention to weight class, her combos will ALMOST always work.People seem to be forgetting that aspect of her. Also, look at other characters with similar styles, meaning linearity, and they're still hard fights. For example Ein. He is extremely linear, but he is still devastating. People know that he essentially only hits mid/high, but does make it any less of a challenge? No, it doesn't. He is even one of the most used characters in this game currently.
The downplay on this forum about her is ridiculous. So is the hate as well. Truthfully I've seen worse, I play Injustice so I see it a lot, but people don't seem to want to acknowledge her strengths for what they are. Just because a character is linear doesn't mean that is justification for claiming so many perceived faults with a character.
If for what ever reason there is a nerf, not saying there should be, honestly just slow her down by a frame or two. Anymore would be pushing it. I know this feeling since I main Lisa and she got hit hard on the frame nerfs.
Anyways, rant over.
I'm not saying she is OP, even my earlier posts never said that, but that she is a really hard fight. She DOES have reach, speed, damage, and she is a heavy weight class fighter so a lot of combos or set-ups will barely work or not at all. Since she doesn't have to pay attention to weight class, her combos will ALMOST always work.People seem to be forgetting that aspect of her. Also, look at other characters with similar styles, meaning linearity, and they're still hard fights. For example Ein. He is extremely linear, but he is still devastating. People know that he essentially only hits mid/high, but does make it any less of a challenge? No, it doesn't. He is even one of the most used characters in this game currently.
The downplay on this forum about her is ridiculous. So is the hate as well. Truthfully I've seen worse, I play Injustice so I see it a lot, but people don't seem to want to acknowledge her strengths for what they are. Just because a character is linear doesn't mean that is justification for claiming so many perceived faults with a character.
If for what ever reason there is a nerf, not saying there should be, honestly just slow her down by a frame or two. Anymore would be pushing it. I know this feeling since I main Lisa and she got hit hard on the frame nerfs.
Anyways, rant over.