DOA5 Terminology..

[EMPEROR_COW]

Hi there,
as I've mentioned in another thread I am currently working on a series of tutorial vids for the DOA5 alpha demo ... these videos are mainly aimed to showcase to players from other games what the DOA5 has to offer as well as maybe giving insight on the system to beginner - intermediate DOA fans...

the issue is that because of this, alot of the older terms are now pretty much obsolete and i think we should get with the times ... and a few major ones come to mind ...

for example:
- counter/high counter HIT/BLOW : i think from now on we should use the term counter/high counter STRIKE as the game describes it ...

the other one is FREE CANCELING: the button is long gone and has been replaced with (yes i know they're the same button... the name is different ) .. so my suggestion would be to start calling this HOLD CANCELING ... i think this would be alot easier to grasp ...

this way we can keep the association of the word "Free" .. to free stepping , and free step dodging ... and avoid the confusion

This is the approach i intend to take in my videos ..

I think it just makes alot more sense to me this way ...

what do you guys think ?

another issue is the word CRITICAL ... its not in the demo (pls correct me if im wrong) ... and i just think the word STUN is alot easier to grasp ... i remember an old post by VirtuaPAI about changing the term to CRITICAL but ... i think STUN is alot easier to understand... especially when coming from another game ... (plus the fact that the majority of us tend to use the word stun anyway ..)

so yeah ... opinions ?

 

[PhoenixVFIRE]

I'll let the big guys talk this one out but I'll go along with whatever works. The only problem I could see is the game is going to change(it's likely to be already different from the alpha version). So you might end having to change things later on if you're able to test a different demo in the future, but then who's to say that demo will be out for the public to use whenever at home and not just tournaments and events.

 

[grap3fruitman]

When you say "hold cancel," it seems like you're implying that something was canceled by a hold, not with the hold button.

You're right, the "critical" indicator isn't in the demo but we still have critical and non-critical stuns in the game. There are stuns (or frames of stuns) you can't hold during and I think it's important to keep the distinction between them, rather than mashing them together.

My two-cents.

 

[Matt Ponton]

Feel free to add any new terminology to the terminology list on the wiki.

 

[EMPEROR_COW]

acctually now that you mention it ...
i seem to be having trouble with the stun section the most ...
particularly because i dont have another pair of hands to help me out (i went through hell explaining holds ... learned to control arcade stick with feet >__> )

can anyone please list for me the different types of stun in the game (a small definition of each would be nice) ?
and possibly the frames by which you cannot hold during that stun ?
this will help me out greatly as I'm almost done with the more or less basic stuff and I'm starting to enter the slightly "technical" territory ...

much appreciated ..

 

[EMPEROR_COW]

heres an idea ...

how about instead of free canceling ... or hold canceling ... (since hitomi can cancel her with or and i can see how that can be confusing)

how about STRING CANCELING ? which is basicly what it is at the end of the day ....
what do you guys think ?

 

[x Sypher x]

heres an idea ...

how about instead of free canceling ... or hold canceling ... (since hitomi can cancel her with or and i can see how that can be confusing)

how about STRING CANCELING ? which is basicly what it is at the end of the day ....
what do you guys think ?

Works for me

 

[DrDogg]

I would prefer "Block Canceling" or "Combo Canceling" since that's essentially what you're doing. Hold canceling is too confusing and string canceling can be misunderstood by a newcomer to competitive fighting games.

When it comes to the strategy guide, I have to at least mention the official term for things (if one exists), but I will also use the community term if it's more fitting. For example, I would have to say "hi-counter strike", but I would probably add, "or hi-counter hit", then use that throughout the rest of the guide because that's easier to understand IMO.

 

[EMPEROR_COW]

I would prefer "Block Canceling" or "Combo Canceling" since that's essentially what you're doing. Hold canceling is too confusing and string canceling can be misunderstood by a newcomer to competitive fighting games.

When it comes to the strategy guide, I have to at least mention the official term for things (if one exists), but I will also use the community term if it's more fitting. For example, I would have to say "hi-counter strike", but I would probably add, "or hi-counter hit", then use that throughout the rest of the guide because that's easier to understand IMO.

well i thought of combo canceling... but then again ... you might cancel while not hitting someone ... (they might be blocking) and ... u can do combos without stirngs ... so ... in my mind that didnt sink in well

moves like are called strings .. and its more or less an agreed upon term ...
and what we're doing is .. canceling the strings .. to to pull off another string or a single strike or a launcher ..
so i just feel that string canceling is more fitting ...

I think this might be the term i will go for in the end if everyones happy ... i just feel its just easier to swallow

 

[EMPEROR_COW]

now about those stuns/criticals ....
can anyone help out ?

 

[Rikuto]

We could attempt to use our powers of infinite influence to make team ninja just turn the button back to .

Something tells me this probably wouldn't be the most difficult thing to do.

 

[DrDogg]

I prefer free canceling to string canceling. String canceling just sounds bad.

 

[Berzerk!]

In conversation cancelling a move animation is just referred to as "cancelling" without a prefix so once you explain how it's done you don't have to repeat the term.

Free cancelling still sounds best because we're used to it, but it would be better if they called it G for Guard and Guard cancelling the moves.

String cancelling is a clunky term but in actual use when explaining the game I do say something similar. First I say the moves are based around strings and then "you can cancel the srtring with H" or whatever it's best called.

I have a feeling H is here to stay. It don't call it Hold Cancelling just say "H-cancel" or "cancel the string".
In most practical sentences you won't need to use it as a special phrase as its not a hard technique, get the concept across once and people intuitively understand you can cancel and delay strings of moves and begin to work it into their strategic thinking.

Yep, intuitive mechanics, nice to have a fighting game like that.

 

[EMPEROR_COW]

well i need to find a term everyones happy with ...
i personally dont like free caceling because free aint there no more ...

i do understand that string canceling is "clunky" but ... lets face it .. when u hear it .. u know exactly what it is... (coming from other games ... ) ... hell I used to use it all the time but never knew what the hell it was called till i joined here and decided to work on this video series ...

i do plan to expand on it in a bit of detail because i think its quite important and unique to DOA and VF... and it really shows the mixup potential of the game ... as well as combo extending ...

the VF guys seem to call it a guard cancel .. but when u ask them what it is they say its a string cancel lol ...

we dont have guard .. we have hold ... and you guys dont seem to like the name i sugested " hold cancel ".. so ...

i do like the term berserk sugested .. H-cancel has a nice ring to it ...

i dunno....
if all fails i think im gonna just call it "string cancel" for ease of understanding ... then when i talk about it in context... im simply gonna refer to it as canceling ...

what do u guys think?

 

[Matt Ponton]

H-cancel makes me think of porn (like a lot of things in this game lol). Because 'H' is the designated shortcut for Hentai/Animated porn in Japan. You would also pronounce it like the perverted term 'ecchi'.

 

[Allan Paris]

H-Cancel and Hold Cancel is the same thing and it doesn't sound right. Even though that may be what the action is.

I personally don't like and I would really like it if they brought back . Free Canceling sounds great and it flows off the tongue.

String Canceling or Cancel doesn't flow either.

What are some other terms you'd like to use? This one seems to be a little hard for everyone to come to something. Lets just come back to this one.

 

[Gill Hustle]

I prefer free canceling to string canceling. String canceling just sounds bad.

Umm, the site is called Free Step Dodge. Think of the ramifications people!

 

[DrDogg]

Why do we need to change the name just because Free/Guard is now called Hold? The Revenge Gauge is the official term of the "Ultra meter" in SF4, but you NEVER hear anyone use the term "Revenge Gauge". It's always, "Ultra meter" or simply, "meter".

I say we keep it Free Cancel and call it a day. No need to change it.

 

[Berzerk!]

Why do we need to change the name just because Free/Guard is now called Hold? The Revenge Gauge is the official term of the "Ultra meter" in SF4, but you NEVER hear anyone use the term "Revenge Gauge". It's always, "Ultra meter" or simply, "meter".

I say we keep it Free Cancel and call it a day. No need to change it.

Agree. Plenty of fighting game terminology that remains in use has carried over whether it's named that way for existing techniques or not.

So if Free Button becomes a legacy thing, Free Cancelling is still an easy term to understand.

 

[EMPEROR_COW]

revenge gauge is called that in the sf4 manual ...

to my memory i dont think any doa manual covered free canceling before ... so the name is open.

free is gone guys ...

for free stepping it doesnt matter so much cuz u dont need the button ...

but for this particular thing ... i dunno ...

i might just keep it free canceling just to keep everyone happy .. but i do personally find this an outdated term and a confusing one at that ...

how about "hold canceling (free canceling)" ... this way we aknowledge the old name and give out the new ..
just a suggestion ...

im still a long way from editing that particular section so im pretty open to whatever sugestion you guys may have ..